Welcome to How Leaders Lead, where every week you get to listen in while I interview some of the very best leaders in the world. I break down the key learnings so that by the end of the episode, you'll have something simple you can apply as you develop into a better leader. That's what this podcast is all about. As a leader, you face long days, tough decisions, and constant pressure. And you want to navigate it all with courage and creativity and all the other great qualities we talk about here on this podcast. But to do all that, day in and day out, you need one thing, energy, and lots of it. Without it, you just won't have the strength and stamina it takes to inspire others. If you want to become a great leader, you have to know how to manage your mental and physical energy. Fortunately, today's guest is the perfect person to help you learn how. I'm talking with Brian Cornell, who has served as the CEO of Target for the last eight years. I got to tell you, he is so upbeat and positive. He is always dialed in, and it's his unrelenting energy that has helped him lead Target as they've navigated massive retail challenges and come out even stronger. He's going to inspire you with his energy, and he's also going to tell you exactly what changed 15 years ago when he started to manage it differently. So here's my conversation with my good friend and soon to be yours, Brian Cornell. Well, I got to tell all my listeners out there that I am looking at a guy who is dressed in 1000% red, and he's got his annual Target meeting, and he's taken a break from that meeting to do this podcast. And Brian, thanks so much for doing it. I appreciate it. David, it's great to be with you. This is my favorite week of the year, because we bring all our teams together to the chance to reconnect and re-energize, celebrate everything we've done and get ready for the holiday season. So in between, I get to spend time with David Novak. Well, thanks for doing that. You just recently received the 2022 Visionary Award from the National Retail Foundation. Congratulations. Well, David, thank you. But I've got to tell you, I view this as a big Target team award. And when I accepted it on stage in New York, I just talked about, you know, this is all about the team who put together a great strategy and has developed an amazing culture. And it's gotten out there and taking care of our guests and each other. You know, since the start of the pandemic, David, we've added over $30 billion to our top line revenue number, $30 billion. And that was all about a team coming together and doing the right things for the guests we serve and taking care of each other. But pretty amazing results. And I share that that is a big team honor for Team Target. Well, that's great. You know, and I have to ask you, what's your vision for Target? And tell us the story of how you developed. Do you have a phrase that you have or how do you describe the vision that you have for Target? I'm here. This is the ninth time I've been part of the team when we have this fall national meeting in September. So nine years have gone by really quickly for me. And you know, when I first joined those first couple of years, we did a lot of testing and we did a lot of learning. But probably most importantly, David, we spent a lot of time talking to consumers and listening to the guests that shops our stores. And back then, most people thought physical retail was going to go away. And it was all about kind of this digital experience. And as we talked to people, we kept hearing it wasn't an either or it was an and people wanted an opportunity to shop in a great store with really good customer service with inspiring merchandise with great value and the ease and convenience of shopping online. So our vision was how do we make sure we bring both of those together? And we really anchored on our stores being kind of the hub of everything we do. So today, if you want something from Target, you can shop at your local store. You can place an order on your iPhone and come by in a couple of hours and pick it up. Or for some, even better, you just pull on my parking lot. And within three minutes, I'll put that order in your trunk and you drive home. If you want it delivered to your home, we've got hundreds of thousands of personal shoppers now through a company we bought called SHIFT that'll bring it right to your home. And during the pandemic, they would just ring the doorbell, put it on your doorstep and back away. So it was all contact free. So we wanted to bring the best of both physical and digital together. And it's really connected with the US consumer we serve. It absolutely has. And Brian, you love to get out in your stores and talk to customers and in fact , shop with customers. And a while back, you actually did that with my daughter, Ashley, and Louisville. You knew she was a big target fan and you took her shopping with you and she walked around the store with you. Do you still do that, Brian, with other customers? Is that something that's part of your process? David, I try to get out all the time. And I learned from my own team. I can spend time walking stores with them, walking in our distribution centers. And I always ask them, hey, tell me what's working and what can we do better? And what are you hearing from the guests you serve? I will tell you, I spent actually a lot of time traveling throughout the pand emic. I was one of those people that still traveled every other week. We had our own protocols around testing and you'd go out for a couple of days and then you'd come back and you'd wait another week and hopefully test negative and go out again. And I learned a lot just listening to Americans who were shopping our stores during the pandemic. And I heard them talk about how important safety was and ease and convenience and the fact that we had really high store standards and it built trust. And I kept hearing this word, you know, I trust target that they're doing the right things. They're making the right investments. They're investing in their team. So I feel safe shopping there. And I hear them talk about target being their happy place where there's these little moments of joy and you get that when you're out there listening to shoppers and our team. And to me, it's so important to be out in different parts of the country and just listen and learn and understand what's working well and what we can do better. What was the most recent market you visited, Brian? And what did you learn? Can you tell us a story? I was in the New York market and New Jersey last week. I was actually in a store that we remodeled pre-pandemic in Jersey City. But I watched it just come to life. We've added tens of millions of dollars of growth. And we didn't recognize when we started the remodel just how that city was starting to change and people who had left New York and are now on the other side of the Hudson. But lots of new housing, new families. And we're kind of a social gathering spot where people come to shop, but they enjoy being out. They enjoy that social experience. David, you know this all too well, but we look at different cohorts of consumers. You know, this Gen Z consumer, they like shopping physical stores. It's kind of a social component for them. They certainly know how to use all the digital technology. But I keep hearing it's this Gen Z consumer that's come out of the pandemic and they can't wait to get out physically, out in stores. They like to walk up and down the aisle and see what's new. So I just kept hearing that this last week that way it's this younger cohort of shoppers. It's these younger consumers that are in our stores on a regular basis and walking the aisles and looking for what's new and exciting. You know, Brian, you and I have been friends for a long time and I remember talking to you when you took over target to CEO in 2014. And I remember you were in an incredibly tough turnaround situation. The business was in the tank and you had to bring it back and you certainly have taken us back and just kind of defined the reality you faced in 2014. So David, I joined just following the major data breach that took place at Target. So I realized that we had some challenges to restore trust. We had also launched the business in Canada back then and opened up 133 stores and built distribution centers and hired lots of team members. But when we entered the Canadian market, we just probably didn't understand how competitive it was. We didn't really understand the consumer and how different they were across all of Canada. And you know, it had a challenge with rebuilding trust in the US and then a bit of a failing business in Canada. I remember you and I talking about this when we were just starting to kind of look at Target and where we would go from here. I was trying to convince you to come to one of our meetings and I recognized that the best thing we could do was exit the Canadian market and put all of our efforts on the US. When I joined back in the summer of 2014, I had no idea that within six months, I'd be recommending to the board that we exit Canada and double down on the US. But sitting here today, I know that was the best decision we ever made because we put all of our efforts, all of our capital, all of our resources and all of our focus on restoring vitality to the US business. We wouldn't be a $106 billion growing retailer had we still been struggling in Canada. Sometimes as you and I both know, you've got to make the tough decision, but long term, it's going to be the right thing for your brand, your team, your shareholders. And that's what happened at Target. Focus is such an important thing for all leaders. What advice can you give on how to really decide what you need to focus on? You obviously had a problem there in Canada, but you've had a number of different big time jobs and bringing focus to a business is something that you're known for. What's your trick of the trade if you have one? It's a great question because we're going through that process right now as we plan for 2023. I've learned less is always more that when you're really focused on three or four big initiatives that you've validated with consumers, you've tested in the market or right for your brand, you know, we're going to connect and provide pathways for growth. You've got to be really focused. I always try to make sure when we talk about strategy, it looks great on a page and it looks great in a boardroom. But are you investing in capabilities? Are you investing in the resource and the talent you need? David, I would tell you coming out of the last few years, the pandemic, the one thing that I've learned that just stands out when I think about priorities is I put a big focus on the importance of culture and making sure that the things we're doing are consistent with the culture of the company and then I can get the team to rally around it. So this morning, we talked a lot about strategy and priorities. I talked a lot about investment in our team, but every day this week, we'll talk about the importance of culture. When I look at those priorities, I want to make sure they're consistent with the company purpose, our culture, and I've got four or five big things that everybody says, "All right, we're going to line up around it. We're going to make sure we resource it and we're going to go out and execute." I want to take you back to 2017 because this is another time I remember talking to you and you made a huge announcement at your annual investor conference. I'm sure you still remember this because it was very impactful to you at the time. Talk about what you announced to your investors in 2017 and the impact it had on you personally. So David, I can take you back to that very moment in February of 2017. As in New York, we're getting ready for our annual investor conference and we sent out a press release in advance of the conference and it said, "Target's going to invest over $8 billion in the next couple of years to remodel stores, to build new stores." We said we're going to invest $1 billion of operating income in wages and training and development. And I'll always remember watching CNBC that morning. And Becky Quick, who I think you and I both know pretty well, is reading the press release and she pauses and says, "There must be a typo." In today's environment, no one is going to invest billions of dollars in physical stores. People were closing stores back there. I'm talking about opening up new stores and remodeling my existing stores and investing in my team's wages and benefits. So I'm seeing the market reaction, David. I'm getting ready to walk across the street to present to investors. And I know what the reaction is. Our stocks in decline, people are shaking their heads and wondering if we're making the right decision. But it was one of those moments where you had to turn the volume down. And I knew we had been testing things. We had been validating things. We had been talking to consumers. I knew it was the right thing, long term, for the brand. But those are moments in our careers that we'll never forget. I finished up my conference. I did an interview at the end of it. David, in the last question was, "Brian, how long do you think you'll last in your job?" So those are tough days. You and I have both been there when people are shaking their heads and saying, "Boy, they are not doing the right thing." I always love those guys that ask me that question. It's interesting. It was an $8 billion investment that you made in the business. But you had already made a number of tests that showed you that spending that $ 8 billion in the way you were going to spend it was going to pay off. So you kind of start as small so that you could go big. Is this something typical that you do as you lead your business? Back to what we learned from Canada and exiting that business. Sometimes you just got to slow down before you can go fast. Testing and learning. David, we started by remodeling 25 stores. It was our pilot lab. We opened up a couple of new small format stores just to understand how people are going to respond. We looked at some new digital capabilities and tested them out really carefully . We were testing these things behind the wall for a while and knew, boy, the reaction was really positive. But now it's time to go live and go big. I knew there are going to be some question marks. I didn't expect a round of applause. But we knew that the consumer enjoyed it. Our guest was enthusiastic about it. I knew it was the right thing for our team and our brand. We just had the confidence as a management team to say, "We're going to go in a different direction." Others were closing stores back then and trying to save their way to success. We said, "The only way for us to grow and modernize the business is to invest in the future," which we did. Brian, if you could go back knowing what you know today, what advice would you give to yourself on how to handle that decision and the way how you communicate it? Are you totally happy with the way how you communicate it? Well, I think there's always lessons learned, David. I think for us and for me personally, making sure you're spending enough time building alignment across the entire team. I would tell you, when I came back from New York, we gathered thousands of people here in Minneapolis. I had some people on the bus. I had others that were probably just scared. They're reading the headlines saying, "Target's placing this big bet. That was the headline, the $8 billion bet." We were going in a different direction. I could have probably spent more time making sure I socialize this internally. I have people understand the why's and the conviction we had behind it. I had to come back and make sure I brought everybody together and said, "All right, let's hold hands," and explain why we did it, what we had heard, why we were so confident. I could have done a better job before a big bold announcement making sure I didn't just enlist a couple of hundred people, but in our case, get thousands of them on the bus feeling confident about the future. Well, it's obviously worked. Your stock has compounded again and again. It's just done fantastically well. You doubled your stock in 2019. Speaking of stock price, you talked about that investor conference. The market didn't react positively. How do you look at the stock price as a CEO? How do you look at a versus competition? How does it figure into your personal scorecard? It's hard to ignore because it's out there every day, people are looking at it. When you're having a board meeting, they're looking at total shareholder return . It is part of your scorecard, but I think at times, you've got to step back and say, "All right, I can't react to any single day." There's so much volatility in the market. We both know that sometimes the restaurant sector is in favor, sometimes the retail sector is in favor. Sometimes people are saying it's all about technology. I think you've got to balance short-term with long-term. You've got to have a conviction that the things you're doing, your investments, your strategy, it's going to benefit shareholders over the long term. You can't overreact to any one day, any one week, changes in the environment, but it's hard some days when somebody is sending you the note saying, "What happened to the stock price this week? Why did you lose two or three points?" You've got to have that focus on the longer term to make sure over time you're making the right investments and right decisions for your brand and your business. We'll be back with the rest of my conversation with Brian Cornell in just a moment. If you want to learn from another CEO who was always at the top of his game, listen to my conversation with Larry Merlow, the former CEO of CVS Health. Just like Brian, Larry understands the power of getting his team on the same page, and it all starts with a simple compelling vision. We took a very small group of our colleagues, and they came back and said, " Larry, we need a purpose." That purpose is one sentence. Our purpose as a company is helping people on their path to better health. It's understood by everyone. David, I knew that we hit the mark, and people have internalized that in very meaningful ways. If you want to align your team, then you need to listen to my conversation with Larry, Episode 12, here on How Leaders Lead. Tell us a little bit about your journey. How did you grow up? Tell me about what it was like when you were a kid. If I go back in time, it's pretty amazing to me to think that I somehow ended up in this amazing role, running a 100-year-old iconic American brand like Target. I grew up in a really humble environment. I lost my dad when I was young. My mom had a series of illnesses, and I had to grow up the hard way. I've worked for as many years as I can imagine, from being just a little kid, m owing lawns and shoveling snow and washing trucks at a crop of Canada, DC. If you look back in time, when I was a kid, you would have said, "There's no chance this person ends up doing what I'm doing." In a country like ours, where you have opportunities, I was able to take advantage of it. I learned really early in life that for me, David, there were only three ways when I was a kid that I could put my economic circumstances aside and just move forward. I found that it was in school because when the test is handed out, nobody cared who my dad was or how much money I had. In sports on the playing field, where the playing field was level, and at work, where once you showed up, it was all about performance and execution and doing the things that were put in front of you. I learned pretty early that that for me was the level playing field. In school, in sports, when I worked, and I embraced that early. I didn't feel sorry for myself. I said, "I'm going to perform, excel, take advantage of opportunities," and somehow, it would all worked out. It wasn't some magical path. I didn't grow up in a CEO's household. I had to work for literally everything I had. Find part-time jobs where I had money for cleats and baseball, but it all worked out because I found what worked for me. I was really fortunate to have great mentors and leaders and people that just cared. You mentioned school was really important to you when you're growing up, and I know you went to UCLA. I also noticed that after graduating 10 years later, you went back to the executive school of management at Anderson. What made you go back to school after you were already on your way in your career? David, I realized I wanted to get better. I wanted a chance to continue to learn, interact with others who were in an executive program that UCLA conducts at Anderson. I learned as much in the classroom as I did from the people that were in the class with me. I leveraged their critical experiences. I was able to learn through some of the things that they had done at CVS or IBM or other great companies. It allowed me to continue to make sure that I was developing and growing and learning. How do you keep that going today? What do you do to stay on top of your game? I've really focused on being a lifelong learner. I think it's so important to make sure in a job like ours, when you were leading YUM so successfully for so many years, or a company like Target that has such an important relationship with American consumers, you've got to wake up every day understanding consumer trends. What are consumers interested in? How are they living their lives? Where do they spend their money? I spend a lot of time and I always have, whether it was here or at PepsiCo, understanding the customer I'm working with. In the case of Target, it's the target guest. I need to really make sure I understand as much about them as possible. I spend a lot of time and I always have trying to understand my competition. I think to be successful in jobs like ours, you need to know as much about your competition as you do your own business. I've learned you've got to be able to manage costs effectively and you've got to build great teams. While the consumer part is important and the customer part is important and the competition is important, and certainly you've got to manage costs effectively, I've always found out. What's your process that you use for going into a store? What's your goal when you go into a store? How do you want to leave the people that you meet? One, I almost always try to arrive unannounced. I want to go in, I want to see things the way our shopper does, the way the basic consumer does. I don't want people to know I'm coming in advance. One of the great parts of that is there's nothing better than catching people doing all the right things. When you walk in and they're not spending days and weeks preparing for it, but they're just doing their job. They're providing great leadership. They're setting up great standards and walk in and understand what they're doing, where I can help, where are their pain points, what are elements that are working for them, where do they have challenges. But I always try to make sure I start by how can I help? Because I'm there to make sure I support them. I've found once you establish that dialogue, people relax. They realize that you're there sincerely on behalf of the company to help them. That opens up great dialogue. They're more comfortable telling me, "Brian, this item over here, it's doing great." Packaging presentation, the pricing, guest shopper, they love it. Over here, we had a problem. Size isn't right. The price isn't right. Somebody's not satisfied with the presentation. I need some help. Once I can open up the dialogue and make them realize, I'm there to serve them. They open up. They're more comfortable and people can really be themselves. That's like that old saying, "Nobody will care about you unless you show that you care about them." By doing that, they trust you enough to really give you the straight skinny versus giving you the company line. I try to make sure they trust me enough that they know they can deliver good news and bad news. They're comfortable either way. How do you view yourself as a leader? What do you think is your approach to leadership? When I was in school at UCLA, I went back and forth about what did I want to do ? For a long time, I thought I wanted to be a teacher and a coach. When I stopped playing football in college, I coached high school football and I coached baseball. I love working with kids. I love being out on the field. In some ways, I feel like I'm still a coach. I get to develop talent and design the plays and work with the team and get somebody ready to come off the bench and jump in when we need them. I want to be a lifelong coach. I've always recognized you can have a great game plan, a beautiful strategy. It always looks good in a boardroom or on the sideline, but it's always the people that have to go out there and embrace it. I've always believed that for me, the best things have happened in businesses that I've been involved in when the pronouns change. Let me explain what that means. When I hear somebody say, "David said," or Brian said, "We need to do this." I usually just shake my head and say, "This is not going to work out well," because they don't own it. They don't believe it. They're doing it because they think it's important to you or to me. When I hear that pronoun flip and it's, "Here's what we're going to do," and here's what we believe in, and here's our strategy, and here's our plan. People things happen because people become accountable. They feel vested. They feel like they're owners and they're empowered. I always look for that pronoun to flip. I love that. That is such a great phrase. The pronoun flip, going for me to weave, that's fantastic. In businesses like ours, it makes a huge difference. When people feel like, "Hey, first, their voice has been heard," you want to hear their point of view. It's our plan. It's not my plan. All of a sudden, great results start to materialize. I was looking at your career and you've been at some amazing jobs. EVP of Safeway, CO of Michael, CO of Sam's Club, CO of Pepsi Americas. What made you shift gears? What was it that made you say, "Hey, I want to do something different?" It actually goes back, David, to the early 2000 period. I had just come back from Europe with PepsiCo. I was in a great role in the US. My phone kept ringing from one of the search companies saying, "Brian, there's this unique opportunity. It's in retail. It's a company that actually is pretty troubled. Might be down on their luck a little bit, but they're looking for somebody to come in, reenergize the strategy, rethink the business plan, build brands. The first three times they called, my answer is always the same. "I love what I'm doing. I'm not interested." I'd hang up the phone. After the third call, my wife looked at me and said, "You keep telling on that ." Every time you say, "No," I see this look in your eye as if you're missing a big opportunity. The reason I was so attracted and ultimately moved from consumer packaged goods to retail is I wanted to see if I could apply everything I had learned from a marketing standpoint, from a leadership standpoint, from a team building standpoint, in a new environment and challenge myself. It was uncomfortable. One of the first things I learned is I had to get really comfortable saying, "I don't know," because I hadn't done it before. I was so comfortable. I knew the consumer packaged good world. I knew PepsiCo. I knew beverages and snacks. It was in my blood. All of a sudden, I had to sit there and say, "You know what? There's some things I understand." But every once in a while, I got to be comfortable telling the team that's reporting to me, "No, I need some help here. I haven't done this before. Can you help me?" One, it humbled me, but I think it also made me more authentic. People rallied around the fact that I didn't have all the answers. I wanted them to be part of the solution. That takes a lot of security, Brian. I remember coming up my career. I was trying to demonstrate to people that I knew what was going on. I didn't really… It wasn't that open about talking what I did know. I got more and more comfortable with that. I agree with the power of that. Was there a point in your career where you hit that pivot point where all of a sudden, you could be vulnerable like that? I think it hit me, David, actually back in 1999. PepsiCo sent me to run a business unit in Europe. I packed my family up. We moved to Brussels, Belgium, and I'm running all these different countries and markets, different languages, different cultures, different competitors. I realized pretty quickly, I didn't have all the answers. Some things looked the same, but people sounded different. There were competitors I'd never heard of. There were different cultural issues that I didn't quite understand. I had to ask a lot of questions. I think at that point in my career, I learned the importance of making fewer statements and asking more questions. I realized that, one, it may be a better leader. First I showed that I did care. I asked lots of questions and I listened intently. I learned, but I really tried to make sure I asked three times as many questions as I made statements. I had to adjust to an environment where the languages were different, the cultures were different, the teams were different. The business model, while it looked the same on paper, it was different country by country. I started to really put a premium on asking questions, being a great listener, and making sure my statements, they make it from time to time. I wanted to measure the number of things that I said. Do you have any daily rituals or habits that you use to get yourself fired up? You're a very positive, energetic person. You can't be this way all the time. What do you do? Get yourself pumped up to go to work. I got involved with a program called the Corporate Athlete. It's a program out of Orlando. They call it the Human Performance Institute. They started out training and working with professional athletes, people who were competing at the highest level. They transitioned this program over for executives like you and I. They said, "How do you manage your energy? How do you train like you're an athlete?" Just for some of that learning from tennis and golf and football and baseball into the corporate environment. It taught me a lot about first energy management. How do you make sure that you're at your best when you have to be at your best? What's the role of nutrition and rest and exercise in making yourself a better executive? I rewired myself. I started to recognize, "Well, if I'm speaking in front of a big crowd, if I've got a really big board meeting, if I've got an important decision to make, I better get some sleep the night before." Just like you would if you're playing in the US Open or you're playing in the Super Bowl. Say, "All right, me. Night before the game. I'm going to get a good meal. I'm going to rest. I'm going to show up at my very best." For me, I also recognize the importance of exercise. Whether it's 20 minutes in between meetings or at the end of the day before I 've got to go off to a dinner function, getting on the treadmill, doing something to manage my stress, build back my energy. I've tried to think about those principles every day. I no longer challenge my teams to show that false bravado when you and I are growing up, go back in the day. Somebody would say, "I was working at 2 o'clock in the morning and here I am at 7 o'clock and I'm ready to go." Do you need something to eat? No. I'm going to go to work. You realize you're asking somebody six hours later a really important question, get an opinion? Well, they're fatigued, they're exhausted, they haven't eaten and you can't expect them to deliver their best. I really try to balance the importance of my energy and try to make sure I never have a bad day. To do that, I've got to get the right amount of sleep, eat well, exercise, and try to bring my best to work every day. That's some absolutely great advice. The other thing I know about you, Brian, is you're a very devoted family man, you've got a great family, great partner, and you're a CEO and you have all these time demands and people like me wanting to interview you. How do you manage that all and put your family in the right priority? Well, David, it's actually has taken some time. I think there's some tough lessons learned for all this along the way. I recognize just how important that balance is, that you have to be able to do both. You can't have one without the other. I think for most of us, the importance of our family, and I know your daughter and the relationship you have with her and the relationship you have with your wife, that's part of who you are. You've got to be able to find a way to balance your passion for work with the commitment you have to your family. When they both come together, again, I think that's where people like you and I find a way to excel. What's your view, Brian, of recognition? A lot of people think recognition is something you should do, obviously, but they don't think you should do it very often. You got to be careful with it because people might take their foot off the accelerator. What's your view on recognition and how often you should give it as a leader? David, I don't think you can give it enough. I think it's so important. I think people want to hear that first you care, that you recognize their contribution, that you're giving them feedback. You want to bring energy to the organization and commitment and getting people to feel ownership. When you recognize their performance and their contribution and what they bring and it just pause to say thank you, it makes such a big difference. I talked about working and living in the US and Asia and Europe. It's worldwide. People want to be recognized and it doesn't always have to be the big giant trophy. People know little thank yous, it goes a long way. Thanking somebody for their contribution to a program or their contribution to a meeting or the fact that they picked up one of their teammates when somebody had an issue, somebody had to run off, take care of one of their kids, they stepped up and say, "Hey, I'll do it." You recognize that? It makes the world a difference. Absolutely. When you think about your company's future, obviously, you're going to need more and more leaders like yourself. How do you focus on leadership development? What do you personally do to make sure that you're developing the next generation of leaders in your company? I would say at least a third of my time is on the people. Working with my teams, working on leaders, thinking about that next generation. We've been spending a lot of time saying, "All right, how do we identify the future executive leaders of target that five years from now, 10 years from now, are going to be sitting around that table?" I see them every day. I know who those candidates are. How do we overcommit to them? Give them the time, share critical experiences, make sure we're elevating their full potential. You've got to commit the time. You've got to be a great coach and teacher. You've got to listen. You've got to be able to share what you've learned. You've got to also be wanting to say, "Here's all the mistakes I've made." I want you to learn from what's worked for me, but also, I want to make sure I share with you, "Here's all the things I've done wrong." I got a long list of all the mistakes I've made. What would be at the top of that list when you look back at your career? Probably, in some ways, David, moving too fast on certain issues, not asking enough questions, not getting full buy-in, running ahead of the team, and watching people say, "That's a great guy. Brian loves this. Let him go." He'll figure it out. You've got to bring people with you. I was a little younger, and I was just focused on performance and execution and making sure that I got the A-grade. I might have run ahead of the team, and I left them behind. I now recognize you've got to bring people with you. You've got to set a great agenda, but if you're not bringing the team with you, flipping that pronoun, you can only do so much on your own. Brian, I saw a Gallup survey on average. 70% of workers in our country today are not engaged. Why do you think that is? They probably don't feel ownership. They don't feel a connection with the company. They may not feel a connection to the purpose of the organization. They don't feel appreciated. If you're not feeling appreciated, and you don't feel an attachment to the organization's purpose, and you don't buy into the direction, it just becomes a routine for you. Your energy dissipates. You're not fully engaged. And ultimately, you walk out. But I think leadership plays such an important part in filling that engagement void. Great leaders build engagement. They provide a platform for people to ask questions, to fill in the blanks, so that you can build that bond with the team. Well, you obviously project a lot of confidence in your people and their future . How important is that for a leader to project confidence? I think when you're in roles like ours, you don't get a chance of a bad day. People watch us so carefully to see our energy level, our confidence, our commitment, our engagement. I think it's critically important because as tough as it is, and I'm still learning to get used to it after all these years, we don't get days off. Can't say, "X Wednesday, I'm gonna have a bad day on Wednesday." No, ignore it. People depend on us, and we have to project confidence. Because if we're not confident, they're not gonna be confident. I believe that to be a great leader, you gotta have a plan to help you develop. In fact, I think this is so important that I've developed a free weekly development plan that you can get delivered to your inbox each week. Every weekly plan focuses on a different leadership topic and gives you action able steps to develop that skill on a practical level. Things like team building, communication, and navigating conflict. Think about this plan as your leadership development program. Only it's no fluff, practical skills that will help you unite your team around achieving your goals. You can get free access at howleaderslead.com/plan. That's howleaderslead.com/plan. Sign up today. With all the success you've had, Brian, CNN named you the CEO of the year in 2019. You're clearly one of the most admired leaders in the world. I know you're gonna say it's the team. You always say it's the team. But if I take that factor away, what would you say has been the key to your success? I sit here today. I am gonna come back to, at least for my target success, this focus on building . A great culture. When we talk about culture at Target, we talk about a culture that starts with care, it starts with growth, and it starts with winning together. I think this focus on a caring culture, caring for the guests we serve, for each other, for our communities and the role we play in society. It's made a huge difference in how we operate the business each and every day. This focus on growth and not just top line growth. But investing in the growth of our team and talent development and creating rewarding careers. The magical unlock is this winning together. A recognition that we're successful when every part of the organization comes together as one. We've got common goals and common priorities and we align around it. But David, I've learned coming out of the last few years that, again, strategy is important and you've got to have great capabilities, but culture makes such a difference. You figure that out long before I did. But a culture of care and winning together, that's what ties our company together. I think our success and the recognition that I've received personally, it's all grounded in this culture we've created at Target that allows us to weather the storm during tough days and celebrate together when we're winning. But we never lose focus on the importance of care and growth and winning together. What's the one characteristic if you were going to pick one that you're looking for when you hire a leader? What do you think is the absolute essential to make a leader successful? There's probably a couple of things David I look for. I do look for humility. I think for great leaders in today's environment, never forgetting where you came from, remaining humble and approachable is so important. I combine humility with the importance of resilience. I think we all know how challenging the environment is that we're working in today. This combination of leaders that have great humility and approachability, they 're resilient. They can handle the good times and the challenging times. They wake up every day energized and passionate about what they do. When you combine passion and humility and resilience, I think you see some fabulous leaders. Brian, you talked about how this company did so well during COVID. How do you think COVID has changed business in the way how you do business forever? If you would have asked me in 2017 or 2018, could we have connected as an organization? Would we have led a big company when you're not physically together every day? I would have said no chance. But I think we've recognized how flexible we can be and how important agility is and adaptability. I think we've learned to embrace technology but recognize that human interaction, it's the great multiplier. I love having my teams together but I also recognize now people are looking for more flexibility and this hybrid working and leadership environment, it's probably here to stay. I had to learn over the last couple of years how to lead in a hybrid environment when I couldn't just walk down the hall and see all of my key leaders. I had to learn how to connect virtually and use Zoom differently. So I think it's going to change the way we lead, the way we interact. I think it's going to be this great balance and it's going to be not an either or it'll be an end. It'll be physically being together and using hybrid to provide more flexibility for our teams and leaders across the world. All leaders we go through are ups and downs and earlier this year, target stock took a major hit because of the inventory management of the company and this really resulted in the company after taking a lot of markdowns which obviously cost you a lot of money. How did that affect you personally and how did you muster up that gumption to keep getting after taking such a body blow? Well David, we saw a pretty significant change in consumer buying habits. After a couple of years of chasing inventory during the pandemic, supply chains , we were running late. We had inventory that unfortunately arrived after the Christmas holiday. We had moved certain things forward and then all of a sudden we just had too much inventory in areas that were red hot during the pandemic. Too many bicycles when we couldn't build them fast enough a year ago. Too many TVs when people were putting TVs everywhere in their homes and things just started to change and we said, "All right, we know we're not alone. There's a glut of inventory and retail. We can deal with this over three, four, five, six quarters or we can face it head on, do the right thing for our brand, for the guests we serve and for our team and put it behind us and get back to playing offense." When we first made the announcement, we certainly surprised some people with the magnitude of it, but then week after week after week, our competitors started to make the same announcements. All of a sudden people were rewarding us for saying, "We saw it first. We dealt with it upfront. We're not going to let it linger and impact our store experience, impact the productivity of our teams." We took it head on and there are no regrets, but those are tough moments when you make big bold decisions, but you know it's the right thing for your brand. It was the right thing for the guests we serve, absolutely for our team. As I've traveled the country, David, since we made that announcement, I hear two words. Thank you. Thanks for doing this. Thanks for identifying. We had a problem getting out in front of it versus just kicking the can and letting it linger on for six, 12, or 18 months. But we both know those are not easy decisions, but when you know it's the right thing for the business, both short and long term, you got to step up and face the music. Brian, this has been so much fun catching up with you. Now I want to have a little bit more with a lightning round of questions here. Are you ready for this? Absolutely. Okay. What are three words others would use to describe you? I hope David, they would say I'm incredibly grounded, approachable, and I hope they would say I'm just a good human being. If you could be someone besides yourself for a day, who would it be and why? Well, David, that's an easy one. I would go back and I'd be John Wooden's assistant coach and get a chance to watch him up front and learn from him every day. What's your biggest pet peeve? I hate being late. I'm somebody who really believes being on time shows respect for the people that you're with and the people you care about. What's the last thing you bought from the target dollar spot? Oh gosh. I've got four grandchildren now, David. So I can be in there all the time buying things. And the last thing was some supplies for back to school. If you turned on the radio in your car, what would we hear? We'd probably hear CNBC playing right now. I'd be probably catching up on the business news. If not that, I'm on ESPN or the PGA Tour Network. What's something about you that few people would know? Well, it's something you know, but many others don't. As much as I love the game, I am just a horrible golfer. That's not true. You're getting better every day. You know, Brian, the lightning round is over. I just have a few more questions here. You know, I used to run young brands and now David Gibbs is a CEO of young brands and doing a fantastic job for sure. And you're the non-executive chairman for young brands. So what have you learned in that role? It's kind of interesting. I don't think there are too many CEOs that are also non-executive chairman. So what have you learned that's helped you in your business? I think when you're interacting with the young team, that culture of appreciation is still something that is just so critically important to their success. You know, I've had the pleasure of getting to know you and working with you. You know, I was on the board with Greg Creed stepping into the CEO role. You know, I helped bring David Gibbs into that new role. And you know, the common thread is this commitment to that culture of appreciation. And I think it's just what makes Yum such unique company. So it's helped me appreciate how important culture is and how fundamental that is to the success of a company like Target and certainly the amazing results you and Greg and David achieved and have been achieving it Yum. You know, you and your wife, Martha, are very generous and you made a $10 million donation to invest in a facility that's focused on helping people with mental health challenges. That's just remarkable. I mean, tell us a story of how you got involved in that. David, I'll start with Martha and I are going to celebrate our 40th wedding anniversary in a matter of days. Congratulations. She's been such an important part of my success, my career, my life. You know, we've got two wonderful children, four grandkids. But I think we've recognized that so many of our friends, family, so many of my team members at Target, they struggle with depression and anxiety. The number of stories I hear about young children who are 12 years old, 15 years old, 17 years old, struggling with eating disorders. The challenges that college students are facing across the country today and so many of them battling anxiety and depression challenges. The impact on older adults. And we said, you know, this is an area that everyone knows someone who's facing some sort of mental health challenge. But unlike other illnesses, people don't like talking about it. And we said, all right, if we step forward and develop this new facility, which we hope is going to be state of the art, how do we remove the stigma and make sure people recognize this is something that we have to address as a country. We've got to make sure we're more public and open about it. So we're looking to create a center that's going to have state of the art facilities to help adolescents, adults, older adults, people with acute care and great outpatient therapy to really make sure we spotlight the importance of investing in a space that I think has been overlooked far too often. That's fantastic and really appreciate you stepping up and doing that. And I want to wrap this up with one final question here. What's one piece of advice you would give to aspiring leaders? I think we've all got to be lifelong learners. And I always talk about the importance of understanding what's happening with consumers, the customers you serve, what's happening with your competition, and importantly, what's happening with the culture of your teams. So I think focusing on those C's, consumers and customers, competition and your own company culture. It's so important and it sounds fundamental. But I think at times we stop looking out the window and watching the changes around us. We take our customers for granted. We lose track of some of the things our competitors are doing and we underestimate the importance of culture. And I think for future leaders, those elements are going to continue to be critically important as we build companies and drive successful businesses going forward. I have to congratulate you on the fact that the board just extended your contract beyond 65. And so you'll be the first target CEO to move beyond that age limit, which is a great testimony to your leadership and the fact that you're getting the results the right way. And I want to also thank you for being on this show and for being such a good friend. David, thank you. It's great to see you. I hope to see you in person soon. Take care now. Don't you just love how upbeat and energetic Brian is? He's an absolute battery pack of energy. And I know his team at Target draws on that energy every day. But that kind of energy doesn't just happen. Brian intentionally manages it just like a pro athlete would because he knows he needs to take care of himself if he's going to perform at the highest level at work. So often leaders think, I'm so busy. I don't have time to go out and exercise. I don't have time to prepare something healthy to eat. I've got work to do. But those simple acts of self care don't take away from our work. They fuel it. We can't neglect our bodies and then expect to be at our best. This week I want to challenge you to manage your energy. Think about one aspect of taking care of yourself that you tend to put off. Now schedule it into your calendar three times this week. Treat it the same way you treat an important meeting. Remind yourself that the time you spend doing it isn't taking away from your work. It's optimizing your performance. It's going to give you energy and your team will feel it too. Positive energy lifts you up. Negative energy brings you down. It's amazing what can happen when you manage your energy and start treating yourself like the high performing corporate athlete you are. Like the entrepreneur you are. Like the business leader you are. So do you want to know how leaders lead? What we learned today is the great leaders manage their energy for peak performance. Coming up next on how leaders lead is Jeff Yang, founding partner and managing director of Red Point Ventures and one of the best entrepreneurs you can ever listen to. Nobody needs to start a company. A lot of people right now feel like I've got to start my company or they think it's really cool to start a company. The best entrepreneurs have an idea and they're compelled to start it because they're like if I don't do it nobody else will. So be sure to come back next week to hear our entire conversation. Thanks again for tuning in to another episode of How leaders lead where every Thursday you get to listen in while I interview some of the very best leaders in the world. I make it a point to give you something simple on each episode that you can apply to your business so that you will become the best leader you can be. Thank you. Thank you. [ Silence ]