Welcome to Howl Leaders Lead where every week you get to listen in while I interview some of the very best leaders in the world. I break down the key learnings so that by the end of the episode, you'll have something simple you can apply as you develop into a better leader. That's what this podcast is all about. And today's guest is Molly Fletcher, who CNN hailed as the female Jerry McGuire for her work negotiating over $500 million in contracts as a sports agent. Now if I were to ask you what you do for a living, my guess is you likely wouldn't respond with "I'm a negotiator." But when you think about it, you're in negotiations multiple times a day. As you collaborate with your team about a project deadline, as your leadership team debates what the company should focus on, heck, you're negotiating even when you're trying to pick out which restaurant you want to go to. The great leaders I know understand they're constantly negotiating and have learned to navigate these situations extremely well. And you're about to learn negotiation from someone who has done a lot of it. Here's my conversation with my new friend and soon to be yours, Molly Fletcher. I want to start back when you were in college. You're playing Division I tennis at Michigan State. If someone would have told you that one day you'd become the female Jerry McGu ire and close a half a billion dollars in contracts as a sports agent. What would you have thought of somebody who told you that? Man, you know, I am like David like you. I'm grateful for the journey I've been on. I mean, it's been an unbelievable ride. I mean, I grew up in a home though where I think if I would have said that at home, my parents would have gone, great, what are you going to do next? Like what's next? What for you? So, you know, like you, I sort of chase this desire to get better every day. And yes, it's been a fun sort of analogy and metaphor at some level that people lean into and go, oh, okay, I get what you did. I see, I see you, you know, and I always laugh right when people say, God, you know, is that movie real? I mean, is it? It's like, hey, look, I mean, he had one client. We had 300. So get your head around that, you know? Yeah, I want to talk to you about that. Well, how did you get in the business in the first place? Well, as you said, I played tennis and then I wanted to get into the business of sports, but I didn't know David, probably like a lot of us at 21 or 22, what that meant , what that he wouldn't look like. And so I got the courage. I saved some money. I moved from Lansing to Atlanta to try to get a job in sports. And, you know, I tell a story often from the stage when I speak about I negotiated a deal to teach tennis at an apartment complex in exchange for my rent. So that gave me a little bit more bandwidth to go out and get a job in sports where you make nothing out of the gates, right? I think my first job at the Super Bowl host committee, I answered the phones. I made 600 bucks a month. So with this free rent deal gave me a little more bandwidth, but I networked, I navigated and tried to get in front of as many people as I could with this mindset and philosophy of how do I get them to like and respect me enough to want to help me or hire me? And if I could get them to like and respect me enough to do one of those things , maybe I can continue to navigate and connect with other people who might be able to do the same. And sort of through that journey over about a year, year and a half, I got in with a small agency in Atlanta that had a few clients and I was sort of off and running getting endorsement deals and appearances for the athletes and coaches we had. How did you really separate yourself in that environment? What did you do to really help grow the business? And that obviously led to your success. You had to do something right there. Well, you know, I'm a big fan like you, David of curiosity. And I think so often in life, we've got to say, you know, what's possible? What if? And you know, it was a day that I'll still remember I had just finished driving Lenny Wilkins around during the Olympics. Lenny was the dream team coach and a client and I was sort of his driver. That was kind of my first little gig. And I would drive him around. Well, when I got back, I thought, how are we going to grow? I mean, how are we going to get more clients? I mean, we have a half a dozen coaches and one baseball player, but how are we going to get more? And I walked into our leader's office and I said, what's our growth plan? And he goes, well, what do you mean? And I said, well, how are we going to get more clients? Because that's at the core what you want. That's how you make money. That's how you grow the business. And he said, it's all referrals. He said, it's been great. You know, Lenny Wilkins referred Chuck Daley and Chuck Daley referred Mike Fert ello. And I said, what if we got more aggressive? And he goes, well, what do you mean? And I was like, well, baseball, I mean, there's a lot of teams here, you know, that Braves and minor leagues and great college programs. And he said, well, you know, how are you going to do that? And so I said, can I just put a business plan together for you to show you how we could start with baseball? I think we could start with baseball and go from there. And I did. And about two weeks later, I presented it and you blessed it. And I was kind of off and running. I was down at Georgia Tech on the wean and on offense, David, with scouts and coaches with chew in the back on bubble gum in their mouth, right? And recruiting guys, you know, it's sort of a fun journey that continued to evolve from there. So you basically changed the business model moving from referrals into actually going out and recruiting people. Do you remember the first person you brought in that way? Yeah, it was a couple guys. It was a first and a third round guy out of Georgia Tech. Two great middle infield guys that I recruited and signed. And then, you know, what happened, David, is like all of us. I mean, you know, those guys percolated through the minor league system and then they would get to know guys. And then I would go visit them and take them to Applebee's for dinner in their little minor league towns. And I'd try to take such good care of them that they'd want to bring their bodies to dinner. And then I'd get to know their bodies who were other first round picks who maybe weren't happy with their agent. And then I'd kind of bring those guys in. And then we got to a point where we had critical mass and I needed help. And so that's when I started hiring other agents and then I moved on to other sports like golf and college coaches and just continued to sort of build the other verticals. At the time you were one of the only female sports agents in the world, you didn't have any women role models you could really look towards. You know, I've written this book called Take Charge of You, How Self-Coaching Could Transform Your Life and Career. If you look back, how did you coach yourself in that? What had to be a man's world? Yeah, oh, it totally was. I mean, I was often the only woman, you know, I'd be behind the plate at batting practice at BP and managers would yell at the guys that were coming over to talk to me. And they're like, dude, what are you doing hitting on that chick? Man, get over here and start getting knocking out some BP. And my guys would go, it's my agent. And the manager would go, really? That's interesting. Or on the range at PGA Tour Events, I was always the only woman unless there was a woman manufacturer's rep. So, you know, how did I coach myself? I mean, to me, it was recognizing the opportunity to reframe the moment. Reframe the moment from, maybe I don't belong here. Like, maybe this isn't going to work. Maybe this is just a good old boy space and I can't add value. I don't know. But to me, it was, wait a minute. I'm different. I think I can connect with these players in a way that's different. I think I can make their lives better in a way that's different. I think I can represent a whole family, not just the athlete if it was a male athlete. So I began to see that I needed to be exactly who I was. I needed to be authentic and that that was enough. And it was an opportunity to drive connection in that way and add value. Yeah, that's terrific. You know, animal, if this is true, it's kind of a crazy thing to even say. But I understand there's more agents than athletes. Crazy. You know, you are in a very competitive world there. What was the role of competition in terms of how it played into how you approached your job? Yeah. And for all of us, we've got to have some level of awareness around what other people are doing. And we've got to be curious enough and maybe vulnerable enough to recognize if there's a gap that someone else is closing and that it's an opportunity for us to up our game a little bit. But I didn't obsess over it. I mean, to me, it was about listening to my clients. It was about over delivering consistently. And it was about ensuring that, you know, I always had this mindset of how do I make sure that my athletes feel like they always own me, not that I owe them. In other words, I wanted to over deliver so much because what would happen, David, it was interesting. I mean, if I'd go see my players on the road, which I would often do, if I had, you know, the Braves were playing the Cubs in Chicago, I'd go because I could see my Cubs guys. I could see my Atlanta guys. And I could, you know, kind of hang with all of them together. You'd come back from the ballpark after a game and these guys would grab a drink in the hotel lobby bar. There's agents waiting in the lobby to pick them off and take them to dinner and take them out. I needed to make sure that my guys respected me, appreciated me enough that they would not even dare when I go grab dinner with that competitor because they just felt , man, she's pouring into me consistently. I can't do that. That wouldn't be right. Right. So that was an important sort of part of that journey for me, for sure. You know, you end up running a sports agency and you have a lot of people working for you. How did you instill that mindset of over delivering value for your team members ? You know, time like you, David, I mean, I am a huge relationship person. I think relationships drive our business success, all of us. And it takes time. I mean, it takes time to build relationships with the people that you lead. It takes time to get in their world and in their heads and their hearts and to connect. It takes time to know what they really worried about, what they're excited about, what their aspirations are. You know, it takes time and it takes real listening and truly caring. And so to me, that was an integral part of being able to lift them up and take them to a place where I wanted them to be the best version of themselves. And so it wasn't that my way was the only way or my way was in fact the right way. It was what is your right way and how can I share some of the experiences that I've had good and bad things I've done right, things I've done wrong with them to help them then serve our clients in a way that was maybe even better than me. I mean, at the end of the day, that was the goal. And that was, you know, it's a business where relationships are so important. Scalability is really hard. So it means as a leader, you've got to teach them and let them evolve and grow to a place that they can manage the relationships, not just you. Otherwise you'll never grow. You know, that's something that could be very intuitive or you could learn the importance of that the hard way. Tell us a story of how you got that insight, that aha moment that said, this is what I have to do to transform myself, not into just an individual contributor, but this is what I have to do to become a leader. You know, a moment that comes up for me is when Matt Coocher, who was a PGA tour player that I represented for a long time, Matt came up to the office and he sat down and I had a young golf agent that worked with me. He was good. He was strong. He had played at Carolina and he was really solid, but he was young. He was good enough to be point with Matt, I believe. And so we're sitting in the meeting and all I did was brag about this agent, Jeremy, is his name. I would just constantly talk about just how terrific he is. He's at tournaments, about deals that he'd done, about rep relationships that he had. I wanted Matt in that moment to feel like he was better off calling my guy than me because I can't scale it if the athlete feels like I'm the one that they need to be in contact with. So it was an opportunity in that boardroom to sort of just brag about my agent to a point that Matt really thought, well, he's better than her. He's who I need to call, not her, because what I love doing was recruiting players and so I needed him to be able to be comfortable with other people in the office to help manage the relationships. It's really interesting. It becomes so important to celebrate the success of others more than you. And that sounds like you got into that very early on. So you're an agent for over two decades and you represented over 300 clients. How did you juggle just the competing priorities? You've got all these celebrities. They've all got a one a piece of you. They want your attention. How did you deal with that? You know, I think for all of us in life, managing expectations is really important. And early in my career, David, I didn't do a great job of that, right? I wanted to get in and I wanted to continue to improve. I wanted to sign players. I was probably not as good at it early. But then as I began to recognize the importance of that and that in fact, when you do that, you set yourself up for a successful relationship with alignment and clarity. To me, the expectation conversation was really important. I mean, if I had a ball guy that I was getting ready to sign, so let's say I'm signing up or let's just say I'm signing a first round draft pack, I needed to make sure that he understood that if I got two lines blowing up and one's John Smoltz and one's him, I'm probably taking Smoltz. He's called, right? Or if you got a first round guy that's looking at you expecting to have a national commercial with Gillette and hundreds of thousands of dollars of off the field money, you had to help them understand that, hey, look, we haven't hit a ball in the big leagues. We got a hot minute before we're there. So managing those expectations was really important. But in the agent business, touching your clients consistently is key. I created really pretty intense systems to ensure that I was touching my clients enough that that connection was there. And one of the things that I did every day, David, was I would stand in my office and I would be each one of my clients for like two minutes. I would get in their head and get in their heart. What are they worried about? What are they excited about so that I could anticipate gaps in their lives before they'd see them themselves and find ways to add value to drive that deeper connection and to serve them better, which was our role. So you really put process and discipline around what really matters so that you could scale yourself? Exactly. I mean, this is a business where relationships matter so much. And so I remember a time sitting in my office thinking about one of my players and I thought, wait, based on the pitching rotation, he's not going to be pitching when he gets to San Diego. He loves to play golf. I'm calling Tori Pines and getting him on the golf course there and getting him a tee time. And I picked up the phone and I called him and he was sort of blown away. Well, those things help offset the worry around competition when you're consistently over delivering, right? And you're anticipating and you're touching them and you're in their world. I mean, at the end of the day, you got to be in their world. And I think that goes for the people that we lead to. You know, Molly, tell me about the culture of your agency because it is a very, at least on the surface, it looks like an extremely competitive industry. And you know, being in that competitive world, that can come with a dark side too, if you're not careful. So what were the things that you really tried to make sure that everybody knew this is the way how we do business? You know, to me, transparency is really important. And I think oftentimes as leaders, it's scary, right? It's scary to lean into that. But to me, that's when you can build really powerful connections, really powerful relations and really powerful teams. And I think, you know, at some level too, as a leader, we've got to recognize that the way in which our employees are compensated play in at a level of teamwork that occurs, right? And so sometimes when I hear leaders talk about how people aren't supporting each other, people aren't pulling in other people on the team to help them on deals, well, how are they compensated? Because at the end of the day, that probably is a bit of a deterrent or a, you know, enticing them to pull people in that can help make the relationship with the client or serve the customer even better. So I tried to create an environment where it wasn't about us. It was about the athletes and the coaches that we served. And it wasn't about you. It was about the team and the collective purpose and the journey that we were on to ensure that we brought in the right kinds of clients, the kinds of clients that on a Saturday afternoon, you're pushing your daughter in a swing, you're excited to see their name and you want to take that call. So we needed to make sure that we were intentional about that. There's lots of, there's 750 baseball players in the big leagues. There's lots of guys to go get, right? So pick the guys that you enjoy being around and that you like and that you care about because as an agent, you know, your job is to ensure that everything in their world is handled so that they can step up to that plate and focus. They can step out on the mound as a pitcher and focus or if it's a goal for that they can step out on Thursday to start a tournament and they know that everything else is being handled or maximized. And that takes time, that takes energy, that takes a team and we had a good one for sure. When you're looking back, you know, what's been the biggest change you had to undergo leading your agency and what did you learn from it? Social media, I remember Aaron Andrews was a client at, you know, a TV commentator and I remember Aaron, I said, Hey, there's this thing called Twitter and I need to get Aaron Andrews. I need to own your name. Like we got to get your name on. What is it? You know, I'm explaining it. Well, what the heck would you use that for? That's weird. And you know, now she's got four million followers and, you know, constant advertising on it and all those things. So it was recognizing the power in it and recognizing that number one, I had to have everybody's passwords because when they'd had a couple too many cocktails, I needed to be able to delete things pretty fast. You know what I mean? But that was probably one of the biggest changes that navigated. Now the thing I loved about it was I felt like it gave good people an opportunity to rise to the top. I felt like it gave authentic people an opportunity for people to see who they really were. And that was really powerful. Ernie Johnson was a client who is the most incredible human being, you can imagine. And, and it was an opportunity for the world to see who EJ really is, which is a remarkable husband, a remarkable man, an incredible father. He's incredible at the work that he does, but he's even a better person. And then for our coaches, you know, college coaches all hate social media, right? Because of their players. And so for coaches, it was an adjustment with them. And it was an opportunity for us to support them, to support their teams, their athletic department. However, we could because social media for coaches is difficult to navigate. You know, you've had a front row seat to athletes who are intentional about pe aking at the right moments. What's that process like? Absolutely. You know, to me, David, I wrote a book called the energy clock because the one of the biggest things that I've seen with the best athletes and coaches in the world is they look at their lives through the lens of energy, not time. Business people though look at their lives through the lens of time and their schedule, not energy. Right. In other words, Tom Brady, he's not obsessed about his calendar. He's obsessed about the kinds of behaviors that align to the performance and the outcomes he wants most. So he is incredibly intentional about where he puts his energy so that he can show up for the big moments. I mean, when I would plan a PGA tour player schedule with him, we'd sit in November, December and we'd look at their schedule and we'd say, okay, here's when all the majors are. Here's the tournaments that you've made the cut in. Here's the tournaments where you've made top 10. How do we ensure that we manage your energy so you peak and can perform in these courses or these tournaments where they matter most? But yet often I think business people accept meetings, accept various obligations and then they get inside of these moments and they go, what the heck am I even doing here? So I would encourage people to say, what are the things that matter most and ensure you align your energy with those things? Look at your calendar through the lens of energy, not necessarily time. So do you think business leaders say yes to too many things and that gets in the way of their performance? Absolutely. No question about it. And they say yes, yes, yes, yes. And then they get to the really big one, the thing in that week or that moment or that conversation that matters most and they don't have the energy or the focus or they haven't prepared enough for that moment. So as aspiring leaders, as leaders, we've got to have the courage to stay focused and say no to the things that don't matter. I mentioned earlier that you negotiated over $500 million in contracts. Why do you think that negotiation is an important skill for all leaders? Well, I would encourage people to think about negotiation. You know, often people say, well, I don't sell, like I don't really need to know how to negotiate or I'm not an HR or I don't need to know how to negotiate. You know, to me negotiation is all over the place. It's negotiating our time. It's negotiating our energy. It's negotiating what we say yes and no to. It's negotiating how we manage, you know, conversations. So to me, it's not just deals and money. I haven't ever met a leader who can't negotiate, right? Because as a leader, we've got to negotiate. We've got to negotiate whether it be with vendors, with our employees, with our clients from time to time. It is an incredibly important skill to have, but I would encourage people to recognize that it isn't just dollars and cents. How do you negotiate or engage in negotiation the right way? What's the process? What tricks up your sleeve do you have? You know, one of the things that I spend a lot of time on is saying and understanding and preparing a ton. What is the person that I'm walking in the room to negotiate with? What matters most to them? What are they worried about? If I was negotiating a baseball player's contract with a team, I wanted to know where were they at from a payroll perspective? Where are they normally at? Who's on the free agent market? Who's in the minor league system? Who could they trade for? We want to get in their world. I think one of the biggest mistakes people make when they negotiate is they spend a lot of time and energy on what they want. What matters most to them? What would success look like for me? Where we're not getting in the world of the person, because sometimes the things that matter most to the people that we're negotiating with might be very different than we think. And I think like all of us in life, the way people show up, we teach negotiation and have a full program around it. And one of the big parts of it is saying, who are you negotiating with? Are they wired financially? Are they relational? Are they logistical? Are they strategic? And then you want to approach the conversation and meet them where they are based on what matters to them and bring the kind of information forward that's going to drive that. I think that negotiation is also about shifting from defensiveness to curiosity . Because negotiation, David, you've negotiated a ton in your incredibly successful career. And to me, it's just a conversation. That's what negotiation is. It's a conversation. So we've got to be curious and ask the right questions to keep the conversation going to take us to a place, hopefully, where we can add value to the other side and reach an agreement. What was the most fun negotiation you ever took part of? The most fun? One of them was when we took one of our guys who needed another 21 days in the big leagues to get his pension for the rest of his life. We got a team to put him on a roster for 22 days so that he got his pension. We didn't make any money on that deal, but boy, was it powerful because we changed his life forever, right? Those were really fun ones. I would say one of the most interesting ones was a guy who's arbitration eligible, which means that if we can't come to terms with a team, then we have to go sit and our player does too in front of three perfect strangers who are then going to assess whether they're going to pay them what we want and what we're asking for, what the team's asking for. And I always felt like I failed if I had to put my player in that situation. And it was sort of apples and oranges. The spread was generally large. It was the night before we were leaving for Phoenix for the arbitration hearing and I'm laying in bed and I'm gone to sleep. We're getting up. We're taking a flight. And at 11 o'clock at night, the general manager calls me and he says, "Look, I know I'm not supposed to do this, but I just talked to my buddy." He said, "You're on that flight. You're going to Phoenix. I can't believe you're doing this. You're taking us to arbitrate. This is incredible." And he couldn't believe it. And he said, "So you're staying firm, huh?" And I said, "We are." And I just paused. And I'm laying in bed. My husband is like laying there. And a minute and a half on the phone with somebody not saying anything is a long time. And I remember after about a minute, my husband goes, "Is he still there?" And I was like, "Yes." And literally a minute and a half later finally goes, "Unbelievably, he goes, " You got a deal." So the other thing I think is important is having the courage to pause inside the negotiations, right? And I think often we think we got to keep talking, we got to keep selling, we got to keep positioning. Sometimes we've done all that in advance. Just zip it. Right? Pause. I think I read somewhere that you managed Billy Donovan. Tell us about the experience and the learning you got from when he was offered the Orlando Magic job. Wow, David. I mean, this was an interesting one, right? And this is why I'm a big believer that we've got to be relational, not transactional. So we do a deal. Billy says to me, look, I want to go to the NBA. I'm tired. He's won two national championships at Florida at the time. And it was like, "Okay, well, cool. You're a stud. I mean, we don't take any NBA job. We got to take the right job." And so time goes by. The Orlando Magic job opens up. Billy says, "Let's go." It starts on about a Sunday. We go back and forth and we negotiate a contract with a Magic. And the terms were terrific. Recruiting contract, highest paid NBA coach at the time. But from Sunday to Thursday, we're just going back and forth with his wife and Billy on the base and the bonuses. And I mean, we grabbed all kinds of extra stuff. I mean, it was a record. You know, it's on the ticker, which is an agent loves that, right? It's on the ticker, on ESPN as the highest paid guy in the NBA. So we fly to Florida. We do a press conference. Billy nails it. Does a great job. 730 the next morning, Saturday morning. He says, "Here's the deal. I can't do it. I don't want that job. I can't do it. I can't leave Florida." And you know, the lesson I learned was I didn't ask him the difficult questions . I didn't ask him any of the real questions. And I think as leaders, we all know this. Sometimes we find ourselves walking out of a room or a meeting or we hang up the phone and we go, "Beautiful." Like they didn't bring it up. They didn't ask that one question, that thing that everybody else seems to wonder about. And now they didn't do this. It's great. I always say, if you want a problem to get good, just park it in a Petri dish. You know what I mean? And it'll get amazing. So we had to unwind that deal. And that was difficult. And the magic were absolutely a class act. And they didn't want a guy. They didn't want the job. But it was also difficult. And it took several days to unwind it and to deal with the media and all those things. But it was tough. And that's why I believe that we have to have the courage to ask the tough questions, to really connect, not just communicate. We'll be back with the rest of my conversation with Molly Fletcher in just a moment. To be an effective negotiator, you have to be a great communicator. In my episode with Tom Brady, he teaches us a simple communication framework called the CCC model that he's used to build strong bonds with his teammates and coaches. I can hold you accountable if I told you, hey, do this or I'm expecting this to happen. If you don't do that situation or what I've said, we're going to have a talk. But if I don't ever tell you what I want, then how can I hold you accountable for that? So if you want to learn how to be an even more effective communicator, listen to this episode with the one and only Tom Brady, episode 53 here on How Leaders Lead. You know, Molly, just getting to know you a little bit here. You know, very few people I've met that have a stronger leadership presence than you, a command and control presence, you know, a confidence. Was that something that you always had and how important is just confidence in the negotiation process and the way how you present yourself? Well, you're kind and you're an incredible leader. So that means a lot to hear that from someone like you, truthfully. So thank you for that. But I think confidence doesn't come from our comfort zone, right? In other words, I think confidence comes from getting uncomfortable a lot and strengthening that muscle and seeing ourselves weather through it. And that the person that comes out the other side of maybe tough moments becomes a better leader, becomes a better person that's leading their people that they serve, leading their clients, leading their customers. But it doesn't come from your comfort zone. I think what it requires for us as leaders is to consistently get uncomfortable , navigate through those moments, learn from those moments, and come out the other side a little bit better. And I think that comes from, you know, my parents were our incredible people that I learned a lot from. And tennis taught me the power of stepping into change and discomfort. And then the opportunity to work and have a front row seat to peak performance for 20 years, I consistently saw the vast athletes and coaches in the world step into discomfort. And they'd come out the other side a little bit stronger, a little bit better. And the byproduct of that is a little bit more confidence in our ability to navigate those moments moving forward. You know, you mentioned your upbringing. Tell us a story from your childhood that really helped form the kind of leader you are today. My dad was a pharmaceutical sales rep. And so he has an incredibly high EQ. He anticipated always really well. He was very relational in his approach. He put in the extra work. So I watched that. And I also though, I think watched a man who he didn't love what he did. He really didn't, but he did it because that was his job. And back then you worked for 40 years for the same company and you got your retirement. And that was that. But it also taught me, you know, I want to love my work. I want to make a difference. I don't want to just get up and go and do for money. I want to make sure that it's something that aligns with my vision and my purpose. So like all of us, we learn good and bad at some level. And so I learned from my dad in a really authentic way things I wanted and maybe things I didn't want. And then my mom was a school teacher for special needs kids who is one of the most giving kind of loving, unselfish human beings I have ever known. I think I learned EQ and sort of sales and some of those things for my dad. And then I learned a lot of leadership and making it about the people that you lead and serve from my mom who was always grabbing my old winter coats and bringing them to school to the kids that she taught that didn't have a warm coat. And then I learned from my mom, I mean, she would, you know, we'd go to the grocery store David and she'd have like 15 coupons in her hand, right? And she'd be like, Oh, that's on special. We're getting that and that's on special. We're getting that. And we'd get up to the front of the line and the checkout person would say, well, you know, this is expired. This coupon is expired. And she would work her like there was no other and that lady would take a coupon. That's where you got it. Yeah. So I watched him not say they didn't accept no ever. No was just sort of feedback to them. And I believe that too. I think no was just sort of feedback. You know, my parents, I say you taught me everything I know. And they're like, well, you took it to another level. And I'm like, no, but I did. I learned so much from them. I still do. And you've learned from all these Keke athletes and elite athletes and coaches. And, you know, one that comes to mind is another one of your Michigan friends is Tom Izzo. He seems to be a really intense guy. What have you learned about how a person and a coach like a Tom Izzo pushes himself every year? He's a lot of success, but he seems to never, ever get satisfied. All the best coaches and athletes that I've worked with have this. I've never arrived mindset, right? They never really are. They're on a journey to continue to get better. They're not chasing achievement rather. They're sort of chasing fulfillment. They're chasing impacting lives. And for Tom, I think at the core, what has always stopped us from taking an NBA job is this desire to pour into young guys, young kids, to be a part of a place where he can really make change and make an impact. And one of the things that strikes me about Tom in particular is he's a guy who , if you watch him on the sidelines, it's like his head's going to explode when he's lightness players up when they come off to the bench, right? I mean, if you've seen him, he gets hot. And I remember asking him once because the other thing that's interesting about Tom is his players love him. I mean, they love him. They can't wait when they get drafted in the NBA to write checks back to the program. They can't wait to take a call and go recruit a kid that Tom's trying to sign and get in. They love him. And I remember saying to him once, Tom, man, you go ballistic on your guys and they love you. How in the world do you do that? I mean, you hold him so deeply accountable and they love you. It's fascinating. It's fantastic. And so he does this thing, David, it's really cool. He takes his guys at the beginning of every season and he puts them in the film room and he gives them a three by five card. And he says, just write on that three by five card. What would success look like for you this season? What is it? I want you right now on that card to write everything down. And they write, win a national championship, graduated all American, graduate with a Bubba 3.5, win the Big Ten championship, win player of the year. And then he takes all of his guys one by one in his office with their three by five card. And he said, okay, tell me what's on your list. And they say, well, I want to graduate with a Bubba 3.5. And Tom goes, okay, cool. So as your coach, what would my role in helping you do that be? Because I want to help you do that. That's one of your goals. And they say, well, what do you mean, coach? Well, if I get a call that you're skipping class from a professor, you know, most people they graduate with a Bubba 3.5 go to class. So would you want me to hold you accountable? Well, yeah, coach, of course, it'd be great. Okay, cool. And you want to win Big Ten player of the year. So when we're up by three with a minute left and you're dogged to get back on defense, you want me to kind of hold you accountable on that because big templers, that 's not what they do. Well, yeah, coach, it'd be great for sure. So he gets them to identify what they want. And then he creates an opportunity to connect with them one on one and gets their buying and support to hold them accountable for what they in fact want. And so he makes them better and they see that he makes them better and they see his investment. I mean, one of my greatest stories of Tom is they played a game. The team lost. It was a team they should have beaten and Tom was, you know, they were upset. The team was upset. It was one of the guys on the team that really just didn't show up. He was one of his leaders. He didn't get it done. He didn't play well. And so the kid just felt devastated. He felt like he let Tom down. He felt like he let the team down. And so Tom watched him leave the locker room and he knew he was down and the team was upset. And so about 30 minutes later, Tom calls the player. He says, Hey, man, what are you doing? And the kid was like, dude, I'm in my dorm room. I'm just sitting here. I can't believe what I did and what I didn't do. I mean, I'm just a coach. I totally failed tonight, man. And Tom goes, Hey, I'm in front of your dorm man. Come on down. Let's go for a ride. This is like 11 o'clock at night. The kid gets in Tom's car. Tom says, my, we drove around campus for two hours and just talked and just shared and I listened. You know, he did things like that and does things like that all the time. And that's why he is an incredible coach, an incredible lead or somebody that people want to follow and people want to play for. That is fantastic. I love that three by five card. You mentioned John Smoltz a little bit earlier. Now here's a guy he went from starter to closer back to starter. He, and he seemed to thrive in every change that he made as an athlete. What did you learn watching him and how he navigated those different paths? John's a guy that loves a challenge. He totally welcomes discomfort. He loves the, I'm not sure if this guy can do this 10 years into his career, go from a starter to a closer and then maybe back to a starter. But it's also one of the things I love about John is that it's not about John and the team needed him in that role. And those 24 other guys needed him and the fans and the community and the general manager and Bobby Cox. And so John said, sure, because it's not about me. It's about you guys and it's about this team. And so sure, I'll try it. I'll step into it. He loves discomfort and he knows that's where he grows. He's a workhorse. One of the other things that always blew my mind about John and continues to. And I think we see this with great leaders. Their capacity is high. In other words, John would call me on this way to the ballpark. And I would hear all the things going on his life with his family, with his kids, with his parents, all these things coming at him from left and right constantly. And then I would watch him step on the mound that night and throw 80 pitches through eight innings and sit guys down one after another. And I thought, if the world knew what was going on in his life, that he couldn 't hold the fastball right because he had cut his finger that morning with a knife. And now he's got to hold his fastball a little bit different. That his arm is hurting him as smudged. So he slightly tweaked his arm slot for a slider. I mean, if the world knew and could see that, it would always blew my mind. And so his capacity is enormous. Molly, it's interesting. You know, another one of your clients is Matt Kuchar, who I know. And he's a terrific guy. And he's been a superstar and the PGA for over 20 years. And you know, he stayed in the game mentally and physically for a long time, competing to the highest level. And you're doing the same thing. What did you pick up from him that's allowing you to sustain your success? You know, Matt is a consummate professional and he always has been. I mean, when he came out of Georgia Tech and he approaches his career, no different than a CEO approaches the way they run their business. And he looks at what are all the things that need to be in place for me to step onto the T-box on a Thursday for me to stand over a put on a Sunday and execute. And he is incredibly intentional. He's incredibly disciplined. He has a fantastic family and wife. He's a man who values that deeply. But he has sustained success, I would say in part because of his discipline and his professional approach to his career. You know, Somali, here you are now. What are you up to these days, you know, in terms of helping others unlock their potential? How do you see your purpose now? Yeah, you know, my purpose now is to lead others, to inspire others, to connect with others and to do it with courage, with curiosity, with optimism. And so I speak, David, about 80 days a year and open and close a lot of conferences, sales teams, all women's events, company meetings. And then we have a training program as well, training company, Game Changer Training, where we deliver training primarily on performance, be it negotiation, be it energy, be it, you know, high potential, high impact programs, to help other people at some level up their game, whether it's from a performance perspective, from a negotiation perspective, or you've got leaders that you want to help get a little bit better, you want to keep them. We're inside of this great resignation. How do we pour into and help the people that we lead up their game a bit so they can pour into the people they lead even better? So pouring into my team to help us continue to grow in these two sort of verticals, if you will, is where I am. And working on another block and I have a podcast to Game Changers, David, that 's super fun. I bet it is. This has been so much fun for me, speaking of fun. And I'd like to have a little bit more fun with you with some rapid fire questions here. Are you ready for this? I'm ready. Let's go. Fire. All right. What are three words that best describe you? Inspire, connect, discipline. If you could be one person for a day beside yourself, who would it be and why? You know, I might want to be Elon Musk for a minute. I mean, getting inside of that noggin I has would probably be kind of an interesting journey. What's your biggest pet peeve excuses people with excuses? What's your favorite major league ballpark? Cubs, regley, I love that place. I mean, it's just it's just it's awesome. It's hard not to toughest general manager to negotiate with. John Sheerholtz, the GM of the Braves, and he's a great friend. I love him. From time to time, we belong in the same country club, but he's tough. The biggest deal you ever closed? Probably a $20 million contract for one of our baseball guys. You know, I got out of the business 10 years ago, David. So now they're $160 million. I'm not sure if I timed that right. But anyway, what's something about you that few people would know? I don't love fiction. I don't read fiction. I don't really watch fiction. I pretty much have no interest in fiction. And that's probably a gap for me. I could probably improve. But fiction is out the door with me. You know, I understand you're a big fan of Zig Ziglar. Could you tell us your experience with Zig Ziglar and what that taught you? David, you know, your preparation is paramount, man. I love it. So yeah, well, my dad, I said, was a pharmaceutical sales rep. So I'd go down to his office and he'd have these zig bucks by Ziglar and I'd read them a lot. Long story short, when I approached graduation, I said, I got to meet him. I mean, I got to meet Zig Ziglar. I mean, I want to do what he does, I think, one day. And so I, you know, seemed up my money. I sent him letters and postcards and called his office a hundred times. And finally, he said, I'll give you 20 minutes. I'll give you 20 minutes, which is so nice of him. I mean, I'm 21 years old. He's given me 20 minutes. And so I fly to Dallas. I walk into meet him, which I couldn't believe. It was so kind of him. And we sit down and we're chatting and I'm asking him for advice and I'm curious and all those things. And I said, you know, I want to do what you do. I really think that's what I want to do. And by the way, David, I say all I had to show for myself was I was second to be our high school commencement speaker when I walked into Zig's office. So of course I didn't really have anything to show for myself as a speaker, right? I said, I want to do what you do. And he said, well, that's great. And he was so nice. I can still see when he leaned forward and he said, well, Miley, here's the deal. Why don't you go out into the world and actually do something and then you can go out and talk about it. And he was right. So I boarded my flight in flew back to Michigan and pursued my other passionate sports. He certainly did a lot. And what's one piece of advice you'd give to anyone who wants to improve as a leader? Serve their heart, not their talent. In other words, pour into their heart, not because of what they can do for you, but because of who they are. And you know, Miley, it's obvious you picked up something from all these leaders and you're making it happen in your own career and have for a long time. And I want to congratulate you on your success. And I can't wait to read your next book. What's the title? Do you have a working title or do you have the title? You know, can you give us a little preview? We don't yet, man. We don't. So I don't want to throw something out that isn't going to stick. You know how that title game works with books, but I hope it's our best one. Yeah. Thank you so much. I appreciate it, Molly. Thanks for being on the show. Absolutely. David's an honor. Thanks for having me. I really love getting to know Molly. And this podcast was so much fun for me. Molly has some incredible stories that I hope inspired you on your journey to become a better leader. And now it's time for my favorite part of these episodes where I give you a little coaching. This week as a part of your weekly personal development plan, here's what I want you to do. The next time you find yourself in the midst of a negotiation, say less. It's so tempting to fill any open space with words, isn't it? I only pause for like three seconds just now, and you probably thought it felt like an eternity. Let me tell you something. I sure did. But what if you learn to use silence as a weapon? Because silence and pausing can be one of the greatest weapons you can ever use . As you heard of my conversation with Molly, it's a tactic that worked for her. And I know that if you start using silence properly, it will help you in your negotiations too. So do you want to know how leaders lead? What we learned today is the great leaders have learned to be effective negotiators. Thanks again for tuning in to another episode of How Leaders Lead, where every Thursday you get to listen in while I interview some of the very best leaders in the world. I make it a point to give you something simple on each episode that you can apply to your business so that you will become the best leader you can be. I'll see you next week. [BLANK_AUDIO] [BLANK_AUDIO]