Welcome to How Leaders Lead, where every week you get to listen in while I interview some of the very best leaders in the world. I break down the key learning so that by the end of the episode, you'll have something simple you can apply as you develop into a better leader. That's what this podcast is all about. Today's guest is Dr. Tom House, a world-renowned expert in the biomechanics of throwing whose coach to lead athletes like Nolan Ryan, Greg Maddox, Tom Brady, and Drew Brees. He's been called a pitching guru and a quarterback whisperer, but if you ask him, he prefers to be simply called coach. Tom is a pioneer who brought the science into the coaching equation. For decades, Tom has used elite athletes to create models that others can replicate. The leadership lesson for us here is that we should do the same in business. We should look to those who come before us that have been wildly successful and then mirror our approach to what they do to build healthy, high-performing businesses. Because here's the thing, the great leaders I know learn from the best and they apply those learnings to be even more successful themselves. And I'll tell you what, there's a lot we can learn from today's episode. Here's my conversation with my good friend and soon to be yours, Dr. Tom House. Tom, it's so great to have you on the show. David, thank you so much. You really did your homework, but I want you to know that using all those words and my name in the same sentence probably shouldn't be. I'm a coach. You said it perfectly. I'm just a coach. Yeah, I'd say you're a pretty darn good coach too. But I can't wait to talk to you about your coaching ability. But first, you've really gotten in the big business side of things. Now, and you've got this startup called Mustard. Tell us about Mustard. What's the mission? Well, the mission is actually to democratize the information and instruction that we've been giving our elite athletes for the last 15, 20 years, putting all that quality into a cell phone and an app to where the mom and dad of a 12-year-old little boy or little girl can film a delivery or a swing in the backyard, send it to the cloud through Mustard and come back with the same analysis that a Brady or a Breeze or a Nolan Ryan would pay 15, 20,000 dollars a weekend for. So again, we want to democratize the information. We want to put it in the kids' hands and just hope that they play longer than what's going on with the numbers right now. There's 120 million youth athletes, boys and girls that are less than 13 years old, that will quit playing by age 14, 80 percent of them. And what we want to do is just keep as many of those kids playing at least through high school because sports are the last venue that will teach affiliation, how to deal with adversity, how to learn from your failures, all the things that a businessman like yourself has figured out through the business world, they can get it through the power of play. You know, Tom, it sounds like you have a noble cause here that you're really passionate about. Yes. And we'll talk about it. Maybe before this podcast was over, but Jason Goldsmith and myself, this was a brainstorm thing when I was up at USC doing research for the Rod Data Research and Baseball Institute. The question came up, I wonder how many Nolan Ryan's have gone home because they weren't having fun or they were getting hurt. I wonder how many Michelle Wies never stayed with golf long enough to find out that she could actually play on the men's tour. And that led us into, okay, can we make it easy and inexpensive for a mom and a dad and an athlete to have fun number one and number two, experience what it's like with good information and instruction to survive in a game of failure coached by negative people in a misinformation environment. Now, that's a lot to take in. But for example, in today's world, it's an outcome world and nobody teaches kids that they're going to learn more from failure than they do from successes. Because parents care and because they don't want to see their child fail, a lot of the kids don't understand that they're going to learn more from their screw ups than they do from their successes. So all the things I just talked about, mustard is trying to put out there and we're not really worried about bottom line, although that's going to happen. We want to inform, instruct, inspire and we want to mentor and make a difference in these young people's lives and see what happens then. You know, it's amazing when you do good, the good comes back to you. And it sounds like you can really change the world of sports for young kids with what you're doing here. We are so hopeful that what you just said will be the outcome of all this effort we're putting in. And I have to give credit where credit is due. I'm the old age and treachery guy. I've been on the field and dealing with sports my whole life. But turning the sports world into the new era of athletics where it's quant ifiable, it's measurable, it's deliverable. I've surrounded myself with some really great people, Jason Goldsmith being one of them, that have allowed us to take old school, bridge the gap to new school and make it friendly and fun for young people. You know, you've mentioned Jason Goldsmith who's a good buddy of mine as well. And we've just written a book called Take Charge of You How Self Coaching Can Transform Your Life and Career. I have to ask you, how'd you end up with that oddball? You know, what do they say? Fleas on a dog's butts have a tendency to find themselves. I was, I think I mentioned earlier, I was doing research and working up at the University of Southern California in the baseball program and Jason was actually working with tennis players and the facilities are right next to each other. And Jason came by one day and sat in on one of our lectures and all of a sudden he's a regular with the lectures. We realized we had a lot in common and like I mentioned earlier when we first started, Jason looked me in the face one day and said, you know, Tom, how many kids go home before they even realized they have potential? And that was the beginning of the mustard science and technology. Well, you're making a dynamic duo and it sounds like you've got a great mission and the company's off to the flying start. And I've met your team and they're all passion. They're all aligned around the mission that you have. There's the founder of the company, how did you instill that passion and really drive home what you were trying to do with this whole idea? Well, I'm sure you know because you've seen it with people that you do. When someone shows up, they're going to show up with ex-battle motivation and passion. No matter how hard you try, you can't give them more motivation. The passion they have is there and if you don't demotivate them or do anything to take away from their passion. You put enough people in the same room with the same interest passion and caring for the process more than the outcome. All of a sudden, the synergy of that group, it starts popping. And when it's popping, it's fun. And using sports, I think the power of play and sports, you don't work at sports, you play at sports. And getting that understood, then business gets easy. And I'm going to try to capitalize this. We may be working on our fannies off, which I know we do. And we may be taking wrong turns here and there. But with the group, everybody we're dealing with, male, female, old and young, has this belief that sports and the power of play are going to make a difference in the world. And it makes it easy with everybody pulling on the same end of the road to get that thing going. I want to stop right here because I think you said something that every business leader needs to really soak in. And that is the power of play. Creating fun. Tom, before you started coaching all these elite athletes, we've already mentioned it, you were quite an athlete yourself. Tell me about your journey. How did you get started? My mom and dad are from the World War II era. And reads like a script. I started off in Little League and played a bunch of sports and was pretty good at it. My dad's job took him from Portland, Oregon, where I started playing all sports down in the Los Angeles area. And baseball kind of took off from it. I kept playing football and basketball, but baseball was literally what motivated me the most. My hero at that time was a guy named Sandy Kofax. And I put up really good numbers in high school for a couple of reasons. I was on a really good team. And I was a lefty that threw a curveball for a strike. So without really understanding why I had great baseball numbers. But it was an interesting thing. My mom really didn't care about sports, but she cared about our grades. She was an Iowa farm girl that knew that having a degree would be long term. So her rule in the house was no A, no play. And I go, "Mom." You know, it's hard to get an English. She said, "If you want to play baseball or you want to play sports, you got to get me A's." So my brother and I, we were straight A students, not because we were smart, but because she honestly believed that if we got A's, we're going to end up getting a degree and being set for life. In fact, on her deathbed, my mom looked me in the face and said, "No, Thomas, why are you going to find a real job?" She could never understand why I played sports and how I could make a living doing it. But with that support, I went on and not only got to play at USC, and I don't know how much you know about raw data when the Trojans, but he was the coach of the century. And I was, again, precipitous positioning. I happened to be on the same team with Tom Seaver, Billy Lee, Dave Kingman, Steve Busby. The scouts would come to watch these studs, and they'd see this little left- handed through a curveball and got people out. A scout like me with a braise drafted me, and Coach Jato said, "Tom, you're not going to get any money to sign, but you can ask for your education through your PhD program, and they'll give it to you." So mom is happy. All right, I'm playing pro ball, and I'm working on a degree. And again, I got lucky that it was set up like that, and then at every situation or every crossroads in life where I could have gone in the tank, there was a mentor. And with that mentorship, it allowed me to number one get my PhD, but number two also play for 10 years in the big leagues and coach 13 more. Wow. You know, when you were at USC, quite a few of the people on your team went on to the big leagues, I think 15 out of 25. What was the culture like that allowed so many of your teammates to be successful? Because usually somebody might want to take over, be the man or whatever. You know, how did that culture bring everybody together? It was, I will tell you with a big heart and a thankful everything that raw data was the reason. Nobody worked harder than we did, period. And he didn't care when comparing myself to Tom Siever, our first bullpen I'm throwing in my fastball is not as good as Tom Sievers. And Rod came up and said, Tommy House, what do you think of young Tom Siever? And I said, Skipper, if you need me to do that, you got the wrong left hander. He said, no, no, no, I don't want you to be Tom Siever. I want you to be the best Tom House you can be. And he was the first one to make me realize that if you did everything he could do to be the best you could be, then you could be confident going between the lines. And that carried over to everything I did in the classroom, on the baseball field, in research. When I went to bed at night and I looked back over the day, I said, okay, did I do everything today to get the most out of what I was put in front of? And if I didn't, I'd write down one or two things to do tomorrow. So Rod was the guy that put that in my head. That's great. You know, and can you tell us a story of when you met Tom Siever for the first time? He had a big fastball. I know. But what was he like as a guy when you first met him? And I'm sure it's the same in the business world. There are just certain people that are recognized as being a little bit better at everything than all the others in the business. And there were a couple guys. This guy, Tom Siever, and there was a guy named Nolan Ryan in Texas that we had all worked for best friends, but we played against each other and knew of each other. And Tom Siever was a man child at age 18. I mean, he was a stud way before anybody else. And everybody knew that if he stayed healthy, that he would end up being one of the best in the game, obviously a Hall of Famer. And then there was this guy, Nolan Ryan in Texas, that we played against in Legion ball championships. So I saw people like that and you know that they're special. But what was most impressive is their work ethic. They worked just as hard as anybody else on the team and they had more talent than anybody in the team. And there's your Hall of Famer's. Yeah, that makes so much sense. And being the Tom House that your coach told you to be, you were drafted by the Braves in 1967 and then after advancing through the minors, you made your major league debut in June of 1971. What do you remember when you look back at that moment when you were asked to take the mound? Tell us about that. I'll be honest with you. I remember getting the phone call saying, get ready, Tom, you're going to face the left hander in the next inning. That ain't boots day. But once I went between the lines and I'm telling the truth, I had to read the box score the next day because I don't remember what happened. I remember thinking, boy, the lights, it's way different in the big league lights than it is in the minor league lights. And honest to God, I did not even remember being in the game. I had to look at the box score the next morning. So yes, I was thrilled to be there. Do I wish I would have actually been able to be cognically aware of how I was doing? Yes. But I wouldn't trade the experience for anything. It was special. And then you had all kinds of highlights, I'm sure. But when you look back, what was the highlight of your professional playing career? Well, the highlight, I hope you don't laugh too hard. The highlight of my major league career was catching Henry Aaron's 715th home run in the bullpen in Atlanta. That's basically my fondest memory and biggest good warm fuzzy was catching the ball and obviously running it back in and giving it to him at home plate. It got me in the hall of fame. I would never have gotten there any other way. That's the highlight of my major league career. And that's probably the good and the bad of it. Well, you know, it's interesting because I understand you positioned yourself to make that catch in left center field. You know, Hank Aaron's a pull hitter. Why would you be in left center field? And I know you wanted to catch that ball. Everybody wanted to get that 715th ball. And Henry Aaron had trouble hitting left handed pitching with change ups down and away. Kind of a screwball like action. So every spring training, three or four times during spring training, Henry and myself would go to a diamond six and do extra hitting. And I would throw him change up screwball, change up screwball, fastball, all away off of a left handed pitcher. And after a while, I got to see that everything that he hit that was away or slightly down, it went to left center. So I had that in the back of my head, facing him, just throwing BP to him. And then when we started, we drew straws, all the bullpen guys with the Braves drew straws. So we would have a territory behind the fence in left field in case Henry Aaron hit a home run in that territory. Everybody agreed to respect the little 10 yard spot. So when I drew my straw, my choice, I still had right down the line and dead center. And I chose left center because I seen where most of those pitches off of a left hand were going to go. And we knew that Al Downing was pitching that night. So what looked like a random event had a little planning involved. But again, for me to be standing there and him hit it was probably a lack of the draw thing. I will say this, everybody talks about what a great catch it was. If I would have stood still, it would have just hit me in the forehead. And I'm sure it's the same way in business. The people that are most prepared handle the most activity. I'm sure that that ball was worth a lot of money at the time, but you ran in and you gave it to him. And what kind of joy did you feel just being able to do that? And what would that ball be worth today? I know what it's worth. If it went on the market today, it would probably sell for about four and a half million bucks. But remember, I'm not money motivated. And it tells you what kind of a businessman I was even at that point in time. The thrill of getting to home plate and fighting through the crowd. And it's actually a picture that's in the hall of fame is me giving the baseball to Henry Aaron while he's hugging his mother with tears in both their eyes. And I can remember when I got to Henry, I said, here it is, Hammer. And he said, thanks, kid. And when I saw the tears in both their eyes, I was stunned because I'd never seen that kind of emotion out of Henry. I thought it was like a lifesaver moment. They had to peel his mom off of him to get the game going. She wouldn't let him go. And I don't think I've ever said this in public or on any kind of a meaty thing before. But the reason she was hugging him so hard wasn't because it was a lifesaver moment. There had been threats that they would shoot him at home plate. These are the things that the average fan didn't know at this point in time. There's the son and mother relationship. She was going to take the bullet. All those things were slamming through my mind at that time. Wow, that's incredible. After your retirement as a player, you became a pitching coach. How'd you make the decision to become a coach? Well, I had been involved while I was playing with a group called the San Diego School of Baseball. And it was Roger Craig, Bob Cluck, and Bob Skinner, who were big leaguers at that time. Bob Cluck was the farm director for the Houston Astros. And in the off season, we did camps and clinics and gave lessons to kids. And it wasn't quite playing, but it was almost as fun teaching. And I also found out that the more I taught, the better I got at what I was doing. So it was kind of the seed was planted when I was working with the San Diego School of Baseball. And then when I got released as a player and had to face, do I want to go to work in the real world? Or do I want to stay in the game as a coach? I really didn't know. And as luck would have it, Bob Cluck, who I'd been under with the San Diego School of Baseball, was with the Astros as their farm director. And he said, "You want to go to Sarasota and be a rookie league pitching coach ?" And basically I said, "Yes, before I even listened to the sentence completed." I started off with Bob Cluck, and I moved quickly as an instructor. I went Sarasota rookie ball to traveling pitching coach to getting actually an offer from the Texas Rangers. After three years were the Astros, Bobby Valentine called and wanted to interview me for his big league pitching coach. I got that job, a coach with Bobby. That's interesting because I want to interrupt you for a second. I met Bobby Valentine when I was in Dallas, and we went to lunch together, and we had a really good lunch. And as I was about to say goodbye to him, and went to shake his hand. Instead of shaking my hand, he patted me on the butt like I was going out on the field. That's funny. I couldn't believe that. I've never had anybody do that after a business like that. Yeah, you met Bobby. He's at Mr. Efere Vest. Tell me he's not. He really is. But you know, you're known for bringing science to coaching. Were you doing that from the very beginning? When did that start? When did you bring your scientific approach to the game? David, I'm so glad we're having this little chit chat. It was right in between being released as a player and becoming a coach. When I became a coach, I started asking, do I believe everything I'm teaching? And my rule was, if I'm not quite sure what I'm telling a kid, if it doesn't feel quite right, I'd write it down and search for an answer. And all of a sudden I have a couple pages of questions that I couldn't find an answer for. And as luck would have it, there was this guy up in Kota de Casa with Vic Brad en, a tennis coach that was doing what they called motion analysis. And motion analysis broke down in delivery at a thousand frames a second. Not what our eyes see at 40 frames a second, but what can actually see at a thousand frames a second. And what our eyes actually see in real time lie to us. Your eyes can only see about 40 frames a second, a guy with a 90 mile an hour fastball, or a golfer with club head speed of 170, 1/250 to 1/500 of a second. Your eyes aren't really seeing what's going on. When you watch a car commercial on TV, the car is going like 70 miles an hour. But the wheels look like they're going backwards or stop. That's because you're only getting 40 frames a second. Well with motion analysis, you could actually see for the first time in the history of sports, what athletes were doing to be good at their skill. And all of a sudden we're seeing things we're teaching weren't actually real. Is it real or is it feel? And that was the beginning of science, bringing science into it. And believe it or not, David, it was not well received. Traditional baseball didn't really care, didn't want it. But we kept pushing and researching. It grew organically. To be honest with you, I had no clue what we were doing. But at every juncture, something held up that allowed us to make a right decision in the right turn. You know, it sounds like, as you mentioned, you had a lot of people saying, " Hey, we don't do this in baseball." You know, what a question you give to people when you get those kind of people putting those obstacles in front of your way. When you're really, you're a major league, no pun intended, you're a major league innovator here. You're really breaking new ground. Yes, we were. But again, I finally understood the difference between role and status and having visibility, but not having quality information. For example, Sandy Kofax was my God. I really, really worshiped him and everything he did as a pitcher. And when we filmed his delivery, it became apparent that what he taught and he thought he did was not quite what his body did at 1,000, you know, what we saw at 1,000 frames a second. So while I took a beating with it, what was not readily accepted, not even believed in till about seven, eight years ago, was I stayed the course because it was true science. Everything I knew from education, we had quantified, we had measured, we had proven within two standard deviations and confidence intervals of 97%. So I knew the science was there and coming up with the teachers to implement the science, it was the belief system we had in that that kept us going, even though we were kind of mocked and criticized and laughed at for the whole thing. So how did you take this belief in biomechanics and how did you use that in terms of, you know, changing your own coaching method? The greatest right we have in this world, I'm sure, is the right to change. The hardest thing to do is make a change and you're not going to make a change until there's a compelling reason. So we knew, when I say we, again, it was myself probably coming from the field with the right questions, but the technicians and the smart people that were working with me, I said, and here's the business side, we're never going to be able to force this on people. So how are we going to get it into the flow and a part of baseball's acceptable protocols? So I started going to organization and said, give me your problems. Give me the kids that are hurt. Give me the kids you can't fix. And if I fix them, I want X amount of finances coming my way. If I don't fix them, it's a freebie. So what we started finding out, David, is if an organization would give me a kid to get fixed, we fixed them and we got paid. And we started looking at the data and we were fixing about 83% of all the problems that baseball was having. So I said, this is rehab. What would happen if we prehabbed? So I trademarked and copyrighted the word prehabbed and I started going around saying, okay, you've got 20% of your pitchers in your organization are hurt. What if I prehabbed and that dropped down to at the most three to 4%? All of a sudden, we got more business that we can handle. You know, all the entrepreneurs I talk to, all the people that create startups, they solve big problems that occur frequently. And you basically built the biomechanical sports business around solving those problems that occurred for the teams, which is very interesting. And now you're solving the problem with mustard of democratizing coaching to people who might not necessarily get the sophistication you have or be able to afford it. You got it. I think that's the reason I'm still pushing as hard as I'm pushing. What you said succinctly there is exactly what my pathway is supposed to be over the however much longer I'm alive. We've taken, we proved it with the big boys and now I want to give it to the kids. And what the kids are vision is to do it in all significant sports. Yeah, all rotational sports around the world, we're going to take, instead of having 80% of 120 million kids quit sports at age 14, we're going to try to get them play sports through high school, which is age 18. And you're using models from the best of the best as your tool to help all these athletes improve their performance and kids play longer and get more out of the game. Open that process of learning from the best of the best and then duplicating it through technologies so that others can learn. Okay, that's very perceptive. A lot of research, initial baseball research, they're going to test 4,000 little liggars. Well because of me playing in the big leagues and having access to technology and be able to get it in a stadium, we did all our initial research on elite major league pitchers. In other words, we didn't have to extrapolate from 2,000 little liggars. We had the best in the world that we modeled from. So our model in baseball, the most effective, healthy pitcher long term that we have in the history of the game was Greg Maddox. So our model became a 6 foot 200 pound pitcher with the same mechanics and timing as Greg Maddox had. And then taller pitchers, the algorithms, smaller pitchers, younger pitchers. We did the same thing in football quarterbacking with Drew Brees. Drew Brees was the most accurate quarterback in the history of the NFL football . So we had the models of the elite, we didn't have to go through the nosebleed of extrapolating from a bunch of non-elite. So when we went into teach, our models, when I said we're 97% confident center for within two standard deviations, that's why. As I've learned more about you, Tom, you're a very holistic coach and you talk about the performance table. I think there are four legs and a table. One is strength training, two is nutrition, three is mental and emotional and four is biomechanics. Why have you come to the conclusion that it's so important for athletes to address all four legs? David, that's a great question. And it's finally becoming mainstream. What I've seen in the 30, 40 years that I've been working with science and technology. Science and athletes, coaches, come to you for biomechanics first, functional strength second, nutrition, sleep for recovery third and mental emotional fourth. And what we designed our models to satisfy was the best information and instruction in each one of those fields. And remember I told you earlier that my mom was really pleased that I went on and got four degrees. Well biomechanics, functional strength, mental emotional and nutrition and sleep. So I've got degrees in nutrition, my PhDs and performance psychology. I've got a master's in exercise Fiz and obviously the biomechanics came with all the motion captures. So you see how it wasn't well planned out, but in the final analysis, we stumbled into the right protocols. Hey Tom, just think what would happen if you knew what you were talking about? Well, here's the I think I know a little, but David, honest to God, every day we're getting smarter things that we've been looking at for 20 years and not seeing. All of a sudden we're seeing things differently. So I don't know if I can have it for the people that are listening to this. Don't ever ignore what you've been doing. Have a look at it. Things look for something new, but don't be afraid to take something new and look back at the old because there's always something you missed or you can improve on. And that model works so well in coaching now because someone that believes more in old school, I said, Hey, I was there. I was exactly where you are 10 years ago and I didn't lose that or change it. I added to it. And now I find myself collaborating more than I'm confronting. Is that a good choice of words? Absolutely. And speaking of these four legs, I want to get a little bit of free advice here for our listeners here. If you could give us one tip, okay, what would be one tip you would give to listeners about nutrition? Okay, a balanced meal 40, 30, 30, 40 percent complex carbs, 30 percent protein, 30 percent smart fat, hydrate early, hydrate often. Those two things and 40, 30, 30 is just a balanced meal and hydrate early, hyd rate often. You should drink one half to two thirds of your body weight in fluid ounces of water a day. Most important time to get it in when you wake up in the morning, get a glass of water in your system and hydrate all day long. So we are one of the most under hydrated countries in the world. And while we have lots of calories available out there, the way we use those calories are not helping us stay lean. So three meals and two snacks a day, most important meal is breakfast. The size of your meal, the calories you put in should be put in before you're going to burn the most calories. Try not to go to bed on an empty stomach. There we go. All right. And how about one mental or emotional tip? Number one, have fun. Number two, you'll learn more from your screw ups than your successes. Ask yourself why? The minute you ask yourself why, you're going to get out of what just happened and into the now, which when you talk to Jason, that's all the matters is right now. And if you do it enough, you're going to learn more from your screw ups by asking yourself why it makes you an avid learner and spy yourself. So those of you out there that have a bad round of golf and you're still worried about it four hours later, that's not really conducive to learning more and how to do it right. So give yourself 30 seconds between swings and an hour after. And if it's not about why I'm fixing it right now, it's not worth doing. You first figure out how your athletes learn and you believe in the idea that the athlete, he or she is in charge, not you. Now how did you arrive at that being the best approach? Because I can say here you're a guy, you study everything, you've got four degrees, you've got all this knowledge and then you're going to say, okay, you're in charge, not me. Everybody has to learn what they actually need to master to be successful. But the way that they learn is a function of mastering not only what you're listening to, but interpreting it and turning it into action. So long story short, the way that your coach or your parent or your peer group teaches may not be the way that you learn. I'm an auditory tax-learner, visualizing is good. But when I hear it and I feel it, I learn quicker. And some kids, if you talk words to them, they don't even hear what you're saying. So as a coach, a teacher or a parent, you have to frame the way you communicate to the way your athlete learns. And there are great tests out there, some of which we've actually have a part of. One of them is called a persistence index. Another one is called the star profile, where it actually identifies the way the athlete learns most efficiently. And what are the characteristics that will allow him to succeed in spite of failures? And if the way you're teaching isn't the way your kid learns, then you're going to have to reframe to make the communication process more efficient. And I think sports are getting better at that. Identifying the way an athlete can turn words and concepts into physical action are now being delivered more efficiently than ever before. That's just a great breakthrough. And I want to get back to your coaching career in baseball for a couple of minutes. So Nolan Ryan, he signs with the Texan Rangers in 1989. And that's a season where you were the pitching coach. How would you realistically say you impacted his career? Well, Nolan was going to be a Hall of Famer without me being involved. When he came to the Texas Rangers, he came because of a couple of reasons. Number one, he played with Bobby Valentine. And when I was actually a coach with the Astros when he was with the Astros, I got to know him and talk about the exciting thing we were doing with technology. So he thought he was going to be done. He was going to play one more year. And one of the things that was important to him was his family. So the negotiation for him to come to the Texas Rangers is when Bobby Valentine said, "Bring your family anywhere. Bring them on the road. Bring them to the field. Bring them to the clubhouse." We will absolutely make sure that you and your family can be together. And then the fact that Nolan kind of knew we were doing things different, throwing footballs and doing motion analysis and strength training, he bought in. And what was supposed to be one year ended up being eight years. And he was a better pitcher. This is what I'm most proud of. He was a better pitcher from age 39 to age 47 than he was 19 to age 39. Yeah, that's amazing. What was his mindset on the Mount, Tom? How did he think? He was a warrior. I started real quick the second or third game that he was pitching with the Rangers. He was struggling a little bit. So by Valentine said, "Go out and find out how he's doing." So I jogged out and I said, "Text, how you doing buddy?" He said, "Tom, I'm doing horseshit." But it's way better than when she got warm up in that bullpen. Get the hell off my mount. So there's his mindset. It got to a point where we had to tell Nolan when he went out to go in a game. We'd say, "Nolan, you got 15 pitches or three outs and then we're going to come and get you. Are you okay with that?" He was, I think, the last old school pitcher that his job was to give you nine innings and he would try to beat you with a bloody stump. You have to drag him out of a game. And he physically prepared himself to be the most durable pitcher in the history of and he was. He really was the hardest man to get a hit off of in the history of the game. He put more innings in, more pitches in than any pitcher in the history of the game. And I'll guarantee you right now, if you went down and you played catch with him, his arm still works. I don't want to play catch with him, you know. But I would love to hear the story about his seventh no hitter and how that's impacted the way you coached today. To kind of set the stage. It's Arlington, Texas. It's hot, sweaty, Arlington, Texas. His back had been bothering him. His left knee was tender. So he goes through his warm-up and he's loosened up. He gets to the mound to warm up to go in the game. And it's not good. I'm watching him and he's bouncing his curve ball and grutting on his change-up and can't locate his fastball. And I'm thinking, "This isn't real good." So I sneak around to the bullpen song and I call Bobby on the bench. I said, "Bobby, that doesn't look like Nolan's going to be good today." And as soon as that came out of my mouth, Nolan starts walking toward the clubhouse. Now I get a little panicky. I said, "Bobby, he's walking away. Let me go find out." I said, "Okay, we'll get Barfield up. I'll go find out what's going on." So I chased him and we didn't think he was going to make the game. So I'm walking up the tunnel and I see his legs coming down from the clubhouse. So I know he's going to make the dugout. He didn't make national anthem. But at the end of the national anthem, he jogs out those through his warm-up tosses. His first fastball, velocity up on the board, 97. He got through the inning, 13 pitches, three strikeouts in the first inning. Comes down and sits right next to me on the bench. I said, "Text, what's going on, buddy?" He said, "Tom, I don't know. But this is one of them in our games." And he goes, "Boys, he screams at every. Get me one. It's all I'm going to need today." So nine innings, no hits, one walk, 16 strikeouts. Now that was cool. That is cool. After the game, I spiked the whole nine yards where the last ones leaving the clubhouse had not to our cars. And I said, "Nolan, help me out here." You literally walked off the mound in your bullpen. What was going on? And he said, "Well, I knew it wasn't getting any better in the bullpen. It had to be better in the game." Now, I knew that as a pitcher. I've had bad bullpen and great game and I've had good bullpen and bad game. So I understood that. And then he added this in and I wrote it down whenever I get a chance. I talk like I'm doing with you and it's in a couple of my books. He said, "And besides, I've done everything I could possibly do to prepare for today's game. If I hadn't want to work, I shouldn't have hired out." And he drove away. And I sat in the parking lot and wrote down everything I just told you. And there's the key to a great lecture and a big lesson for kids. You may not be the best player or pitcher on the field, but if you're the best prepared you that you can be going all the way back to raw data, then you can be as confident as anybody on the field. And that's one of the messages we deliver wherever we go. It's one of the mustard applications. You're not asking you to be something you're not, just be the best you that you can be. You're right. After you started working with him his later years were his best years. But I understand he taught you the concept of active rest. What's that? We prepare to compete, to recover and repeat. Anybody you see on the elite level, they're working their butts off. There's not very many lazy athletes that you look at on TV. That monotonous overtraining leads to neural stagnation, which leads to lack of performance. When you add in muscle failure and fatigue from competition, those three things are deadly for an athlete. Real performance inhibitors. So you have to figure out how athletes recover and some statistics we found that on the major league level, an elite starting pitcher that recovers in two days has a two game swing on his record. Instead of being 10 and 10, he's 12 and 8. And 12 and 8 is a million a month in the big leagues. So we were looking for ways to have athletes recover in that two day timeframe. But then you get overachievers, you get athletes that are obsessive compulsive about how much work they put in. And it takes some convincing and it takes some testing to show them that active rest actually promotes recovery. So you can't lay off throwing, but you can lay off throwing off the mound. And I'll tell you what we did with Nolan. We have a drill called the towel drill, which weighs three ounces. And Nolan loves to throw. He's got to long toss, throw, throw, throw, throw, throw. But we were figuring out that he was getting into deficits physically when he was throwing too many pitches in bullpen in between starts. So we took the baseball out of his hand and put a three ounce towel in his hand . And we did what we called the towel drill, where he was actually going through the throwing motion on the mound, just like he was pitching in a ball game. It was with a three ounce towel that took nothing out of his arm and his recovery combined with doing all the work in the pool instead of out on flat ground when it came to running and giving him an extra day of rest in the weight room. His body bounced back more efficiently and he lost very little fastball. In fact, the last fastball he threw in Seattle at age 47 was 97 miles an hour. So we learned from Nolan, you prepare, you compete and you recover and you monitor how they recover and the timing of the recovery. And he would just workloads, sleep and nutrition around active rest so that if they recover quicker than the competition, they're going to be dominating when it gets done to the other wire. And I'm so proud of not just Nolan, but that whole pitching staff with those protocols, we had seven pitchers throw into their forties off that 10 years that we were there with Nolan and our group. Cool stuff. Well, I can definitely see why Tom Brady has hooked up with you and become such a good friend and you're a coach at him because you certainly helped him with his longevity. When was it, Tom, that you made the transition into coaching quarterbacks? Well, we threw a football on a baseball field and I'll give credit requests to when I was with the Padres as a pitching coach, their head trainer, Dick Dent, had the pitchers throw a football for their running. They would run past patterns and throw a football to make it less boring. Well, I started watching and I saw that all my elite pitchers threw the football perfectly and the guys with bad mechanics couldn't make it spiral, didn't have any accuracy. So I started throwing the football as part of training protocols for not just mechanics, but the fact that it weighs 15 ounces. So there's some strength training involved and it didn't take long before I realized that if this works for pitchers, I wonder if I could learn more if I started working with quarterbacks. So we took that bio-connects aerial model and I think my initial quarterbacks were Burlai, Montana, Marino, Morinovich. I had about six or seven. I didn't know what I was looking at. We just filled them. And as it turned out, quarterbacks have exactly the same mechanics as a pitcher does, but they're on flat ground so they don't stride as far. The 15 ounce football and a five ounce baseball means that when you throw in a football, you have the same arm action, but a shorter arm path. But all the other things fit the same. So does the physical conditioning and weight training look at Tom. And when he saw that Nolan lasted till age 45 plus, I actually sat down with Coach Belichick and Tom Brady when we first started working with him and Belichick says, "You 're telling me that he can throw in age 45?" And I said, "Yeah, we've proved it. If he's willing to do the work, which Tom does, there's no reason he can't do it 45 when he did it 25." And now he's proven exactly what we learned in baseball. You've worked with Tom Brady and the Drew Brees of the world and I've heard you talk about them working to get 1% better. I remember Brady telling me, "You do that 1% every day and you'll be surprised what you wake up in our Sunday." How does that play out in the actual training that you recommend? Every night when you're hitting your sack or brushing your teeth, ask yourself, "What did I do today to make myself better?" And we're not looking for huge 20% gains. We're looking for small gains. And small gains are more easily achieved if you can identify the actual problem or what needs to be fixed. I remember the phrase, "Prolome identification is half your solution." So if it's a mechanical issue, we have measurements and protocols to fix that. If it's a functional strength issue, we have measurements and protocols to fix that. The same with mental emotional. The same with nutrition and sleep. So pick something to get better at. And I have athletes write down three things. And they don't always get all three things done. But if they just do one thing better tomorrow that contributes 1%, they have to get better or at least hold their own. Because the aging process, some things decline, there's nothing you can do about it. But if you're working on other things like, Tom isn't probably as strong as he was when he was 25 years old or as efficient body wise as he was at age 25. But his mind, his experience, and his ability to make decisions and not make the same mistakes have grown. And he's hung on to the same level of performance. But the overall key you hit it dead on, try to be 1% better at something in your football life or your baseball life every day. And those are the ones that have long-term success. Makes so much sense for business as well. And we're such an outcome society, Tom. What's your view on how you get the results? We all want to have results no matter what our vocation is. We're all focused on that result. How do you get the result in your mind? It's a tough sell. And I'll pretend like I'm talking to a mom and a dad of a kid that is a 12-year -old that's getting frustrated because he gave up a home run or he's getting beat. In today's world, you said it best. We are in an outcome society. You get your college scholarships. You get your multi-year contracts by putting up great numbers. But what people don't realize is you can't control outcome. You can only basically control the process that gives you a chance for a better outcome. And when parents can understand that your child failing is actually a better learning experience than your child is succeeding, anybody can go good. But the thing that makes a person a long-term achiever is understanding that failing is just adversity. And if you can cope with adversity, that will allow you to stay the course and the process that helps you cope with adversity is what determines a better outcome. And you have to be allowed to get permission to fail. My mom used to say if it doesn't kill you, it's a learning experience. And that's one of the things that has helped me as a coach and a player is my self-identity, my self-concept was not tied up in success or failure. It was tied up in process. How about Drew Brees? He's phenomenal, talent, great quarterback. What makes a Drew Brees successful? Well Drew Brees is Tom Brady with not quite the toolkit. I got involved with Drew when he was with the Chargers. He was in his contract year where he was getting ready to sign a multi-year deal and he blew his shoulder out. We got him into Dr. Andrews. Dr. Andrews put him back together. He called me and said, "Okay, he had a good surgery but I don't think he'll ever throw a football again." I had known Drew for two years before the injury but I really got to know him during his rehabilitation. What we did with Drew is we tailored a program specifically to address where his trauma and his shoulder said he'd never throw again. We came up with shoulder protocols we're still using today that have done properly. You'll never hurt your shoulder. We learned how to quantize energy in, energy out, what to do to stabilize a mobile joint. What it boiled down to with Drew is he took all the same research, everything that we've been doing, mechanics, functional strength, nutrition, sleep the whole nine yards and just did it with the same dedication of a Tom Brady and a Nolan Ryan and turned a career that for a 5, 11, maybe 6 feet, I think is what the program says. Most accurate quarterback in the history of and trained him to literally survive the game of football by not taking more out of his arm than he could put in. The active rest thing, the functional strength, you can only accelerate what you can decelerate, the stabilizing of the shoulder. All that stuff that we learned on him not only helped him throw as long as he did a Hall of Fame career, but it trickled into what we're doing with the younger quarterbacks we're working with right now. You had an interesting opportunity to work with a couple of pitchers that resulted in the story that created a feature film. Tell me about the million dollar arm and your work with Rinku and Dinesh from India. This is a hell of a story. This guy JB Bernstein who went over to India to do a reality show where he was looking for 30, 40,000 Indian kids to find anybody that could throw harder than 95. If they threw harder than 95, they had a chance to win a million bucks. So they did. They went throughout the country. I think I heard 35,000 athletes they looked at and they ended up with four athletes, none of which could throw harder than 95. But all four of them were 92 and 93 with an occasional 94. Well, two of them couldn't travel the United States, but Rinku and Dinesh could . So JB called me and he said, "Would you take on two kids to see if you could get them to throw harder than 95? And if we can get them signed, they'll win a million bucks." So bottom line, I said, "Okay, but you're going to have to do it to where they 're safe." I know we could probably improve some arm speed, but arm speed without functional strength is injury and I don't want to hurt these kids. And he said, "Okay, well, how long would that take?" I said, "Probably six months to a year." So he checked with his money people and they said, "Okay, we'll do it." Well, I didn't realize that he was really, if you watch the movie, he was really on a budget and these kids were pure. I was at SC as the pitching coach at that time and they stayed in one of those big homes right down by campus, showed up every day, worked with the Trojans, kept getting better and better and while they were working on the field, they were also learning the game. They had to watch everything they could with video on how to play the game. The first day, for example, Rinko didn't know how to work at drinking fountain and Dinesh asked why the shortstop didn't have a base. Neither one of them had ever played catch before. They thought the glove was to put on your throwing hand to keep it warm, but because they didn't know anything about baseball, the teach was actually easier than having to unlearn something. So long story short, after about six months, both of them were popping in '95, it went over and had a tryout in Phoenix that they bombed on because I'll try to clean this up. We call it rectosfincture Alice. They were so nervous that their bodies wouldn't let them throw hard. So that's a big point in the movie where they thought they let the whole country of India down. Three weeks later, we retested at USC and they signed with the pirates. Rinko got as high as AAA. Dinesh, I think, peaked at high A-ball. Dinesh is actually the best pitching coach in India right now. And you know why he's the best pitching coach in India? Because he's the only pitching coach in India. I was going to say, there's more cricket than the baseball for sure. You're exactly right. But the bottom line is both the kids, we showed that if you followed protocol and were consistent, that we could pretty much turn any athlete into a thrower. So that's that story. And as you mentioned, they both got drafted and I understand you got a bonus check and you turned around and you gave it to the guys. What made you do that? It wasn't a huge check. It was 25 grand because I'm in the last two minutes of the movie. And for that brief cameo appearance, the Disney people paid me 25 grand and I wasn't sure if Rinko and Dinesh would ever make it in the game. So I gave it to them. Well, a couple of years ago, I ran into Rinko. He's now a MMA guy down in Florida and I said, "Hey, look, now that you're making big money, whatever, how about paying me back that 25 grand again?" He said, "Oh, Coach Tom, that money is no longer available." So... Who played you in the movie? Who was Tom Housen in the movie? Bill Paxton. And my wife says, Bill Paxton did a better Tom Housen than Tom Housen. That's great. Yeah, so yeah, that was a very fun learning experience that summer. You mentioned that you've had a lot of mentors in your career. Who would be the most influential mentors in your life beside your parents? Rod Dado, of course. He was the one that made me realize I could never be Tom Siever, but I could be the best Tom Housen I could be. There is a low-profile guy, Clyde King, who in my AAA years in Richmond, Virginia, I was not doing well. I was... As a starter, I was not getting people out and probably looking to get released . Clyde said, "Come on Tom, we're going to go for a walk." And when the manager asked you to go for a walk, you know it's not a good sign. So he sat me down out in the bullpen and he said, "What's your ERA first time through the lineup?" I said, "I really don't know." He said, "It's a little bit more than two, which is very good." I said, "Yeah." So I'm starting to get a little bit more optimistic. He said, "What's your ERA second time through the lineup?" And I said, "I don't know." He said, "Well, it's about 4.7.5, which is not good." And he said, "What's your ERA third time through the lineup?" I knew this one because I never got three times through the lineup. He said, "What are we going to do with you?" I said, "What are you going to do with you?" I said, "I don't know. Send me down to AA release me." He said, "No. I'm going to get you in three or four games a week and never have you go more than one time through the lineup." I was in the big leagues three months later. So you see how lucky I got there? He figured out that I was good if I didn't get overexposed. So that was that. Another mentor on top of that would probably be a guy named Tony Stellar, who was a heart surgeon that kind of underwrote all the research that we started off with the area system. And because he wasn't money motivated either, he was very wealthy. But if I would have had to pay for all that, it would have never been done. So those four people are probably the reason you and I are talking right now. Yeah. Knowing all that you know now, Tom, if you were starting in major league baseball or football or any of these rotational sports that you're specializing in now, what would you look for in a coach? Well, somebody that is athlete first, self second. If you're not kid friendly, if you're not in it to help the athlete, you're never going to come across as authentic. So there's a sender, there's a receiver when it comes to information and instruction. You have to find a way to communicate what you know and do it with no strings attached for the athlete to actually succeed. If there's strings attached, the information is never received as efficiently. And I can honestly say that from when I was a player and when I was a coach, the kids read it real quick. Kids and dogs recognize authenticity. That's one of my rules. When I have coaches and I want to find out what their real makeup is, I'll put them out with a bunch of 12 year olds, which is my favorite group to work with. And kids recognize real quick the coaches that actually care about them first. I'll give you my exact three rules. Tell the truth. Do the right thing when nobody's looking and wouldn't make your mother proud. When we're certifying coaches, I tell them you can use a variation on that theme. But if you're not telling the truth, if you walk by a piece of paper and not pick it up in the dugout, then you're not our kind of guy. And then literally again, the mother thing, if it doesn't make your mother proud, don't do it. You know, Jason, I wrote this book on taking charge of you and self coaching. How would you coach someone to improve on their own? I've read your book twice. It's actually a nice little primer. It says a lot of things that are very translatable in the sports world too. So how do you coach yourself? Again, we'll start with, did I do everything I could do to be the best I could be? There's insight, hindsight and foresight. And are you able to literally look at yourself intrepersonally and look at how yourself works with outside yourself, which is intrepersonally? And are you authentic? Do you have tools to teach with and do you give information unconditionally? In other words, think of yourself as a boy scout, but you're in a particular sport. What I see most coaches, they literally coach to stay in the game rather than coach to be in the game. And they'll have success, but the long term successful coaches, the ones that affect change and create athletes in large numbers that survive are the ones that give uncond itionally. And all they ask are the athletes that they commit to be the best they can possibly be. While we're on the subject here, we've got a lot of parents listening in today that have kids that are athletes or want to do well in sports. What advice do you give parents on how to handle their kids in sports? This is a toughie because we live in a world, I think they call them helicopter parents or snowplow parents, you have to let your kid fail. You have to hold him to a commitment. Like if your kid's going to sign up for a piano and he figures out he hates it after two weeks, you're going to fulfill the commitment to the piano lessons that you signed up for. And then you can move on accordingly. What the world is trying to do with kids is expect them to learn from a cell phone. When in a classroom or in a learning situation, the harder it is, the more they actually learn, even when they can't solve the problem. The research that we're getting is that 83% of Hall of Famers are late bloomers . And they had to figure out the hard way how to experience, gain knowledge and wisdom, not having it done for them. If you have a cell phone right now, you really don't have to go to college. Because everything that can possibly be asked could be answered by the cell phone. But that's not going to make you any smarter and it's not going to make you any better. If you literally have to struggle to learn, you're going to learn more efficiently long term. And what we're doing is creating a generation of athletes that can play it really well on the games, the Sony's and whatever. But you put them between the lines and they don't understand the feelings of adversity, anxiety, stress. And those are the things that make an elite athlete. Managing the stress and anxiety, understanding that everybody gets nervous. You're going to fail probably more than you succeed. Even the Hall of Fam hitters fail 70% of the time. Hall of Fam pitchers fail half the time. But that's not the message that coaches and parents are delivering right now. Earlier on we said, "Game of failure coached by negative people in a misinformation environment." Learn from your failures, call it fail fast forward. My mom was great at this. We come home and I said, "That's really no here today." And my mom would say, "That's great. Did you get your English paper done?" My dad, I said, "Hey, Pops, I threw a no here today." My dad was the ultimate nerd. My dad would say, "Okay, first of all, what is a no header? Second of all, can you do it again? How did you do it?" So my family was a what and a how and not a reward or a criticism for the actual outcome. When I say we live in an outcome world, parents, it's hard for them to watch their kid fail. And you have a daughter I just saw when she was growing up in the system. Didn't it kind of tear you up to watch her when things didn't go right? Sure. You want the best to happen to your kids at all times. Isn't that good? You said it better than I could ever think of. You want the best for your kids, but you can't do it for them. I can honestly look you in the face and look back at my life at age 75 years old. I have never not laughed or had a good time on the field and practice her again . The average four-year-old will laugh or smile 400 times a day. The average 40-year-old doesn't laugh or smile 400 times in 10 days. Look what we've done. Our world has programmed what you're doing right now. You're smiling. Think about not smiling for a whole day. That never happens in sports. Yeah, it takes a joy out of life with that kind of attitude. I want to ask you a personal question here. I had cancer myself, my wife has a type 1 diabetes since she's 7-acronic disease. That's tough having a chronic disease. You've been diagnosed for Parkinson's disease. How do you take all of what you know, Tom, and apply it to your approach to managing Parkinson's? How have you coached yourself through this health challenge? Well, David, I'm telling you, I'm still in the midway in this journey, but I was misdiagnosed for about three years. When the final diagnosis, and it had some relevancy, they told me that I'd be sitting in a wheelchair, probably drooling on myself in eight, nine years. I'm nine years into it. I've slowed down. I'm not as quick on the up-check as I was. I get tired. My voice gets away from me. You know what? I think the fact that I get up, I probably work hard physically now than I did when I was playing Pro Ball, but getting out and just taking a step and getting the momentum going, I think that's keeping me going. The fact that conversations like this, I just came back from a camp in Atlanta where we had 20 kids and about 20 coaches just being on the field and hanging out with them and seeing how much fun they're having. I think that's helping me push the Parkinson's back. I'm on all this for some human trials with stem cells, which in primates, I've been 100% cure, so I've got some hope, but I'm not giving up. On the days when I have, it feels like a marathon to get out of bed and brush my teeth, I get out of bed and brush my teeth. By the end of the day, it may not be as much as I would have liked to get done, but I haven't given up yet. I haven't given in. Are you still working now two hours a day like you used to and getting two hours of a normal life because of that? Pretty much. I will say I am taking a nap now, no matter where I am, and I qualify this coming up front. After lunch, before I go back to the field, I need a half an hour to 45 minutes . If you can't plot that in, I'm not coming to your camp or clinic. So the one thing I'm allowing myself is a power nap in the afternoon. Everything else, it's just like it used to be, but I am slowing down and I am depending on other people to do things that I don't have the energy or the time for. Tom, all the research says that the happiest people in the world are other directed. Your focus on helping others has got to be one of the main reasons why you're smiling and keeping it going. You probably know this better than I do as successful as you've been. It seems like the more people you help, the more people come back and make your life better. Is it the book, The World's Greatest Salesman where the more you give, the more you get? No question. So it's somewhere along those lines. You know, I have my good days and my bad days, but overall, I am truly blessed. This has been so much fun and I want to have a little bit more before we wrap this up with some rapid fire questions by lightning rounds. Are you ready for this? Yes, sir. All right. Three words that best describe you. Humble, hungry, and always looking. That's four words. That's all right. If you could be one person for a day beside yourself, who would it be and why? Sandy Kofax, just to throw a 99 mile in our fastball saying, "Here it is, hit it." What's your biggest pet peeve? Stupid. I don't do stupid very well. That's something about you that few people would know. Probably that I really like people. Now that's a hard one to believe. It seems to be so genuine and you seem to love people. Well, there's a lot of people that think I'm kind of a small mouth butt head. It used to be that, again, when I was in my confrontation phase where when I knew I didn't do stupid, if someone didn't agree with me, I'll make it really easy. I've been in 50 fights in my life and my ass kicked in 46 of them. So small man, big mouth equals ass kick, but I really, truly do enjoy people. The best pure athlete you ever coached. Wow. Best pure athlete I ever coached. That's a toughie. A kid named Kenny Rogers, the left handed pitcher that could stuff a basketball , scratch golfer, pitch 22 years in the big leagues, was a quarterback and football. Best pure athlete Kenny Rogers. Last one, your biggest coaching accomplishment. I don't think I've done it yet. I'm really happy with some of the things, but I think the best is yet to come. You've got all these aspiring leaders listening in, Tom. So what would be one piece of advice you'd give to anyone who wants to improve as a leader? The best advice, be authentic. Be yourself. And when you are yourself, the people that are supposed to find you will find you. If you try to be something you're not, you'll never know who you are. I love that. The people who are supposed to find you will find you. That's great. That's a good question. What legacy would you like to leave, Tom? How do you want to be remembered? As a mentor, kids. Well, you're well on your way. You're basically changing the game for the world with what you're doing with mustard, democratizing, coaching, giving people the opportunity to have access of the know-how that you have. And I can't thank you enough for taking the time out to share your story and your insights. So thank you very much, Tom. David, thank you. I'll power around with you anytime. Now, that Tom House is one heck of a storyteller and one heck of a coach. And speaking of coaching, I have a brand new book out called Take Charge of You , How Self-Coaching Can Transform Your Life and Career. In the book, I talk about the importance of being an avid learner. There are so many ways for us to learn, whether that's through regular conversations with the mentor you aspire to be like, reading books from successful leaders, or listening to podcasts like this one where you learn straight from the horse's mouth. Being an avid learner and then applying what you learn is the key to success for any leader. So here's what I want you to do this week. I want you to subscribe to this podcast. I don't want you to do this for me. I want you to do it for you. Believe me, there's no profit motive here. These episodes are absolutely free for you to listen to. There's a coaching motive, however. I want you to be the best leader you can be. And my gift to you is the opportunity to learn from the very best. I want you to add a one hour block to your calendar each and every week where you'll commit to your own development and listen to these episodes. By applying the lessons you learn from these conversations with amazing guests each week, I know it'll help you become an even better leader. So do you want to know how leaders lead? What we learned today is that great leaders learn from the best. Thanks again for tuning in to another episode of How Leaders Lead, where every Thursday you get to listen in while I interview some of the very best leaders in the world. I make it a point to give you something simple on each episode that you can apply to your business so that you will become the best leader you can be. I'll see you next week. [BLANK_AUDIO] [ Silence ]